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Alex.
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June 28, 2006 at 11:37 am #18769
Alex
ParticipantDuring several conversations over the last few months with fellow repair companies, there seems to be a trend in “investing” in Van trackers.
I know some of the big boys such as B.Gas Hotperloni etc. do use a tracking system. Obvoiusly I can see the benefit to them as regards engineers whereabouts. I do feel however that a “spy in the cab” takes away some of the mutual trust between those out in the field and the management.
I’m being told that Duty of Care comes into effect when you operate a fleet, and on behalf of the engineers, maybe I need to go for this. In addition there is a new regime with tax on private use that kicks in April 2007, and there is a risk they may have to pay back tax should it appear that they are using the van weekend etc. I have compiled a disclaimer regards this, and should an engineer declare they do not use the vehicle evenings etc. that they are prepared to suffer the penalties levied by the Inland Revenue should they abuse it.
I would be interested to know from engineers how they feel regards this, and from any companies that use a tracking system.
One advantage I feel the engineer will have from this is, when we try to pass on another call, if we see the engineer is running behind, we would not even attempt to add to his workload. Another advantage is where the customer either says, “He was only here 3 minutes, or the engineer never called, or didn’t wait whilst I done school run Shopping” etc.
The advantages to me of course are there to be seen as well.
Any thoughts!
Alex
June 28, 2006 at 6:27 pm #180305admin
KeymasterRe: Vehicle Tracker
one of our members has used tracker for at least 2 years, I’ll call him to see if he’ll post.
My own opinion is I’d rather retain the bond of trust with my engineers, they don’t use the vehicle and declare so to the IR as per the rule change.
Kevin
June 28, 2006 at 6:39 pm #180306superfix
ParticipantRe: Vehicle Tracker
We had them fitted to our vans a good few years ago.
Then out of the blue about six months or so ago a geezer came and “reprogrammed” them. Was told by said geezer that this stopped the tracker sending out it’s signal 😕 .
I was told the company found the license etc. to expensive to be of benefit. Personally I have my doubts as to the fact that it has been disabled.
Cynical, moi 😆
June 29, 2006 at 8:35 am #180307appboy
ParticipantRe: Vehicle Tracker
My fleet has been equiped with trackers for four years now and I am about to upgrade to the latest web based system which shows all the vans on the map at once in real time and shows if they are stationery or moving and what post code they are at!
I find them very useful and only look at it if any engineer is giving me cause for concern. I can see at a glance how long he has spent on site and what time he starts work and finishes. It quickly highlights the engineers that are struggling and means you can analise training needs more accurately. Our system displays the engineers driving pattern and speed which helps identify the engineers that are hammering your vehicles, once they know you can see that they soon adjust there driving! There are many reports this device can create such as daily, weekly mileage reports and usage out of hours, weekend etc!
So in a nutshell I like it and would recommend it to others who want to increase efficiency in their business, it’s not cheap at £40 per van per month but I feel I get value for money and you only need to pass one extra job to the engineer to pay for it! Take a look at http://www.minorplanet.com 😀June 29, 2006 at 8:56 am #180308Martin
ParticipantRe: Vehicle Tracker
appboy wrote:it’s not cheap at £40 per van per month
Another classic example of technology going mad and the extraodinary reasons for justifying the expense quite absurd. So whilst the ‘fleet owner’ may regard this as a useful asset I’m sure that perhaps
the hard working overworked, underpaid and mistrusted engineer will have a different view?June 29, 2006 at 10:43 am #180309kwatt
KeymasterRe: Vehicle Tracker
Actually no Martin.
It would actually save a fair bit of money in a multi-engineer business when you start getting the calls just after lunch asking where the engineer is, often despite telling the people that you wouldn’t be there till the afternoon. It saves money by saving phoning the engineer with “when will you get to Mrs….” and saves annoying the engineer with stupid queries like that.
It can allow you to monitor the van by calculating the MPG etc or pinpoint the vehicle if it breaks down. Indeed, if it were stolen the Police might even find it of use.
However, like any technology including old ones like a pistol, it’s not the technology that’s of any danger, it’s how you use it that is.
K.
June 29, 2006 at 12:43 pm #180310Martin
ParticipantRe: Vehicle Tracker
Suppose you have 5 engineers and ‘trackers’ installed in their vans at a total monthly outlay of £200 (£2,400 p.a.). Mrs Bloggs is shouting and balling on the phone asking where engineer 4 has got to. You look at your tracker display, he is in the middle of Glasgow right now. You try to figure our which direction he is going? what speed is he going? Is he stuck in roadworks or buying a bag of crisps at Morrisons? You take a gamble and tell Mrs Bloggs that he’s on his way to her??…… So far has Tracker proved its worth?
Martin’s method…I would phone engineer 4 and ask where he was then as a courtesy let Mrs Bloggs know the outcome (cost equals 2 short phone calls – a few pence spent there). Tracker didn’t solve that problem!
So then how about if Tracker could indeed help calculate MPG and alert you if a van had broken down somewhere? Now we have already stumped up £2,400 this year to know it didn’t help Mrs Bloggs but we did at least know exactly where he was in Glasgow at the time – well almost ? But how is his MPG going? and has his van broken down?
According to the log he submitted last month he did 1,855 miles and spent £355 in diesel. (That equates to about 25 mpg) Using Tracker shows that he did indeed cover 1,855 miles but 120 of them where out of hours. So unless he admits to 120 private miles and stumps up the £23 he owes, Tracker may have caught him bang to rights, clawing back some of the £2,400 in the process?
The office closed at 5, no-one to monitor Tracker to see he was still working but unfortunately his van had broken down on the way to his last call. The Tracker was flashing SOS – but in space no-one can hear you scream!
June 29, 2006 at 1:00 pm #180311PIP-pm-
ParticipantI suppose im the lucky one I work solo no other engineers to monitor or worry about im responsible for my own van (mpg when it’s empty i fill it up) Only device i have is my satnav (never get lost system) and my mobile which i use BT call divert from the woorkshop (never miss a call so Mrs blogs comes straight through to me first time and i tell her what time i will arrive.
Job Done
June 29, 2006 at 1:16 pm #180312kwatt
KeymasterWe get at least two to three enquiries of that nature per day at a minimum, people are demanding these days. Cutting out the call to a mobile, which is between 10 and 25 pence depending on the network to and from during working hours. That’s not the real cost though, its the hassle factor of calling the engineer to find out where he is if he’s even got reception and you get an answer. Added to which it’s just time wasted making calls that should not really be needed.
Now, rather than think on it from your point of view as a sole trader, think what it’s like for the girl sat in an office that controls fifteen engineers. The reduction in cost and telephone time can prove substantial.
I can see you don’t agree with it and that’s fine as, TBH British Gas killed the idea off for alot of the engineers by abusing the system (IMO) from the engineer’s point of view. But that’s just big company mentality for you, used sensibly it could or can help.
I dare say you’d have been one of the people that were anti tachographs as well, also billed and hailed as “the spy in the cab” all those years ago. We suffered an outrage giving our engineers pagers, then a few years later more resistance to the introduction of mobile phones. In the office we had massive resistance to computers and databases.
All of which now have been proven to be invaluable tools, even if they were not regarded as such on introduction.
Simple fact is, technology moves on and you choose to either use it or not.
K.
June 29, 2006 at 2:13 pm #180313BSH-MAN
ParticipantRe: Vehicle Tracker
boro wrote:We had them fitted to our vans a good few years ago.
Then out of the blue about six months or so ago a geezer came and “reprogrammed” them. Was told by said geezer that this stopped the tracker sending out it’s signal 😕 .
I was told the company found the license etc. to expensive to be of benefit. Personally I have my doubts as to the fact that it has been disabled.
Cynical, moi 😆
Yes, they have been switched off.—————– just to be sure, I unplugged mine. :plug:
What a huge waste of money. 🙄For those thinking of fitting them, we had to have on/off switches fitted, so the engineer could switch it off after hours to comply with E.U. human rights legislation.
:stir:June 29, 2006 at 7:53 pm #180314Martin
Participantkwatt wrote:Simple fact is, technology moves on and you choose to either use it or not.
It’s been a fun debate twixt you and I Ken ,as ever, with little or no input from others during that time (more’s the pity but hey 😉 ). But lest my point is not realised here I will spell it out to all who care to take note.
Employ a first rate team of engineers that enjoy what they do and will do it to their best ability, first and foremost. Give them the tools, the van, the stock and the technical notes. Then agree a daily work rate with each individual ( some are capable of doing 8 jobs a day- others possibly 12?). Give them those jobs and then let them get on with it…….
Then, (and here is the important point!)……afford them all the trust, the space and the respectibility that goes with the job. Enjoy the unique work ethic between each individual in your team and most importantly, enjoy the return from that individual. Who, in his own small way is striving to do all that you ask of him, day in, day out……..
DON’T …fuff about spying on their every move with your friggin’ modern satellite systems, checking their every movement on your VDU in the office…..(cos with your Tracker you can I know, they know 🙄 ) How many times do they visit the loo during the day I wonder ? Does that show up as well? Can they afford to take the time off work?
Speaking from the engineers point of view now. I will do your 10-12 jobs a day, no problem…but stick a spy in my cab, (don’t you trust me to do that?)….STUFF YOUR JOB!!!!
Leave BIG BROTHER to Davina Mc Call and the nurds that watch that programme……!!!! 👿
June 29, 2006 at 8:29 pm #180315Alex
ParticipantRe: Vehicle Tracker
Oh! I only asked.
The passion on this one is incredible, and yet not one employed engineer has felt the need to complain bitterly. I feel that those that do may well have something to hide. I would not be permanently spying, I would read the printouts and if there was a trend, then would show an active interest.
Running a busy office we are getting a fair few customers calling to ask whereabouts, and then find the engineer is unreachable, or dare I say it phone is off because he is fed up with being bothered.
Advantage to engineer; he had a pig of a day, on the running order he only had 7 jobs, and very little mileage, but he asks for an hour’s overtime as he got home late, and I go “Oh Yeah”. With tracker, he has a case.
Another advantage to the engineer; say he started early that day, and another call comes in for the area we suspect he may well still be in; so we promise Mr Smith “He’s in the area, and he can fit you in later today”. Phone engineer, poor area, finally get him at 4.30 and he is well away from where we thought he was. If the weather is good, some are on the road very early in the Summer to miss the holiday traffic. Tracker can confirm this.
Another point that was made to me on this, a team with varying skills and performance, there could be one guy persistantly taking the Michael. The other lads are aware of it, dare not say too much to management, and feel they are carrying someone who maybe are undermining the company, and yet is on the same pay.
Customer is out, insists we failed to wait for her. Look at the log, engineer was sat outside for 15 minutes.
Advantages to me, goes without saying. However, despite Martins statement of nobody hearing you in space. Being web based, and the fact I leave the office late in the day, I can quickly look and see who if anyone is still on the road. I would give him a reassuring phone call to see if all is well.
Have priced it up, some are without capital investment, and are about £30 per month per Vehicle. At the moment only considering it though.
Alex
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