Home › Forums › Public Support Forums › Help And Support › Dishwasher Help Forum › OK to set water softener slightly too “high”?
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smarko.
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August 9, 2008 at 10:47 pm #38651
smarko
ParticipantHello!
What sorts of problems might I get if the water softener on a dishwasher is set slightly too high?
I have a recent Bosch dishwasher. My water hardness is 19.3 degrees Clarke. The hardness setting has a range from 15 to 20 degrees Clarke. So I am near the upper limit of that range. Should I adjust the water softener to be in the next range (20 to 25)?
I would like to get better cleaning at lower cost because softer water needs less detergent. Or am I going to get costs in extra power consumption and salt to run the softener?
Thank you for any info.
(BTW my water isn’t metered so I’m not worried about the cost of extra water for a higher setting.)
.August 10, 2008 at 12:21 pm #259538Trilobite
ParticipantRe: OK to set water softener slightly too “high”?
It probably doesn’t matter whether the softner unit is set slightly high, because:
(1.) The hardness of the water supply may alter during the course of the year, as the water table goes up and down.
(2.) Some basic machines only have a two or three position setting (eg. soft water/medium hardness/very hard). So you might not be able to finely tune the machine to the softness required.
(3.) Some more intelligent machines use an ‘Aquamix’ method to protect glassware (reduces chances of glass etching). They can sense the degree of softness/hardness and mix the soft water with ordinary tap water to protect the glassware. They also only use soft water when required, such as washing and the final rinse, possibly using standard water for intermediate rinses.
For what it’s worth, the Bosch machines seem to have very low salt consumption. I have a Bosch ‘Logixx’ that was refilled with salt at the beginning of April, and the machine has still not indicated to me to add salt, despite being used daily. It has a 7-position hardness adjustment, computer controlled, and is set to the mid-point.
Conversely, my parents have an Indesit-made Hotpoint, with the type of softener described in (2.) above, and that machine will only last a month before it requires refilling, even though it is set to the lowest hardness. It probably softens all stages of the wash cycle, rinses, etc.
So I wouldn’t worry about it.
August 14, 2008 at 9:34 am #259539smarko
ParticipantRe: OK to set water softener slightly too “high”?
Trilobite wrote:It probably doesn’t matter whether the softner unit is set slightly high, because:
(1.) The hardness of the water supply may alter during the course of the year, as the water table goes up and down.
(2.) Some basic machines only have a two or three position setting (eg. soft water/medium hardness/very hard). So you might not be able to finely tune the machine to the softness required.
(…snip…)
So I wouldn’t worry about it.
Hello TrilobiteThank you for your reply. I must confess I hadn’t at all realised water hardness varied so much! I looked again today and see the water authority reports the hardness has changed from 19.3 to 20.6 degrees Clarke. This means it just about takes me into the next softness setting on my Bosch. So I see what you mean!
Can I ask you some more about detergent use?
It’s no good making a softer water setting to use less deteregent *IF* the result of some combinations of chemistry plus dishwasher behaviour means the cleaning quality ends up poorer.
As Imentioned, I do not get etching of glassware (at least not that it is obvious) although my saucepans seem to have had a thoroughly good drubbing where there is bare metal which may be no more than the removal of previous stains.
Is it correct to say the following? Provided the cost of salt refills is not a problem, then an owner could simply turn up the water softness to just below the point where glass etching takes place. In fact, is this how the water softness setting is determined by the manufacturer?
Thank you for any other help and info.
August 15, 2008 at 11:22 am #259540Trilobite
ParticipantRe: OK to set water softener slightly too “high”?
It isn’t to do with the softness of the water as such, more to do with the susceptibility of the glassware to certain detergents and temperature.
For example, I have ‘Pyrex’ (by Corning) glass bowls and they seem to be excellent at resisting the effects of glass corrosion/etching.
On the other hand, I have various items of French manufacture: ‘Tefal’ pots & pans with glass lids; ‘Arcuisine’ branded glass bowls and ovenware. These are most certainly the worst for showing the effects of corrosion. The glass displays a whitish bloom that can never be removed; an iridescent ‘rainbow’ can be seen under certain light angles; and silver mirror effects can also be seen.
The detergent also has a large part to play in the corrosion. Older powder detergents and current liquid dishwasher detergents use a chlorine bleach in a more aggressive alkaline formulation. This formulation removes tea tannin stains perfectly and makes stainless steel shine, and can even combat the pink plastics caused by tomato sauces, but it can etch glassware very badly. Starchy stains such as pasta and mashed potato, might not always be removed successfully.
Modern powders and tablets use a less alkaline formulation, supplemented by oxygen bleach and enzymes. They are more successful at removing starchy stains, are gentler on glassware, but less likely to prevent tea and tomato stain building up.
As for detergent dosage, it depends upon your machine, but most manufacturers recommend about 20-30g of powder, or one tablet, for a normal wash.
What should be noted however, are the intensive cycles. Frequently, these programmes have a heated prewash at 40degrees C. The instructions call for additional detergent to be added, either to the floor of the machine, lower part of the door, or a special compartment on the dispenser. A Zanussi manual I looked at the other day, mentioned adding a portion of another tablet to the floor of the machine. The main wash will reach 65-75degrees C., and the hot water will cause damage at a quicker rate, than at a lower temperature.
Also bear in mind that cutting back on detergent may prevent items being cleaned successfully, as one of the functions of detergent is to suspend the soil in the water, preventing redeposition of said soils.
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