Home › Forums › Public Support Forums › Help And Support › Dishwasher Help Forum › Siemens SE25M570GB not heating up – guidance sought please
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withanee.
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January 16, 2012 at 9:24 pm #67404
withanee
ParticipantHi to you knowledgable folks out there.
My 7-year old Siemens dishwasher is failing to heat up the water, I have done some troubleshooting and would be grateful for your guidance on what I have found and next steps.
The symptoms:
- – the wash water is not heating up at all, on any program
– the program does not run to completion, but restarts about half way through (at least that is what it is doing now; we first noticed the fault when unloading the dishwasher at the end of a cycle and seeing that the dishes were wet, cold, and very dirty – coated with a soap/fat emulsion by the looks of it. Since then, testing with an empty washer, about half way through the cycle (intensive) the clock goes back to the start)
– the fault is repeatable
– The washer appears to fill and empty normallyWhat I’ve found:
I have taken out the control PCB and found a scorch mark and blown joint around what I assume is the heater relay – picture here:
There is also a corresponding black mark on the PCB casing.
With power off (of course) I have put a multimeter across the two wires in the large connector block that attaches to the middle of the PCB, near the heater relay. I am assuming these connect to the heater. The meter shows open circuit.
So, on to my questions for those in the know:1. Am I right to deduce that the burnt PCB is the cause of the fault? (Looks pretty certain to me!)
2. Does the open circuit across the wires mentioned above indicate that the heater has failed too? If so, is it normal to get two simultaneous failures like that? (Note I haven’t verified that these wires go to the heater, nor have I tested across the terminals on the heater itself – I’m not sure where to find those, to be honest).
3. Assuming it is the PCB at fault, is the board repairable, or does it have to be replaced? I see costs of around £130-140 for this part (ouch)and similar for the heater unit it that has to be replaced too (double ouch).
4. Are there any other possible causes/related faults I should check for before shelling out for a new PCB? I would hate to then find I have another expensive fault that would have meant I would have been better off buying a new machine with 5 year warranty. Perhaps of relveance here is that twice in the last 3 years or so we have had to replace the pressure chamber in the RHS of the machine due to it becoming gummed up, but the symptom both times then was that the drain pump kept running when the sump was empty. That isn’t happening now, and from a quick visual with the side off the chamber looks pretty clear (last changed 8 months ago). But is there any other likely cause of no hot water that I should check while I am at it?
Very grateful for any advice received!
January 16, 2012 at 10:05 pm #367353iadom
ModeratorRe: Siemens SE25M570GB not heating up – guidance sought plea
There is a water flow operated switch in circuit with the heater. 😉
PCB looks like the cause of the fault, there has been a recall on these but I think it is for earlier models than yours, have you checked the model number and FD number on the BSH web sites?
January 16, 2012 at 10:18 pm #367354withanee
ParticipantRe: Siemens SE25M570GB not heating up – guidance sought plea
Iadom – thanks for your quick reply.
iadom wrote:There is a water flow operated switch in circuit with the heater. 😉
OK, so I should expect it to be open circuit, correct? Is there any risk that the heater might have failed as a result of the PCB fault, or vice-versa? One £100+ repair I can live with, but if both the PCB and heater are faulty, then I might look at a new machine instead.
iadom wrote:PCB looks like the cause of the fault, there has been a recall on these but I think it is for earlier models than yours, have you checked the model number and FD number on the BSH web sites?
Yes, I checked (only found about it when researching this fault :eeek: The batch number falls in the range, but the model is not affected. No free repair for me!
Anything else I should check while the machine is in bits?
January 16, 2012 at 10:39 pm #367355iadom
ModeratorRe: Siemens SE25M570GB not heating up – guidance sought plea
It would do no harm to isolate the heating element and give it an isulation test. Its usually just the PCB although the water diverter can also blow the modules your picture looks like a bad/overheated solder joint, is there a relay on the other side of the PCB from the burn mark?
January 17, 2012 at 2:34 pm #367356withanee
ParticipantRe: Siemens SE25M570GB not heating up – guidance sought plea
iadom wrote:your picture looks like a bad/overheated solder joint, is there a relay on the other side of the PCB from the burn mark?
Yes – the burnt-out joint corresponds to a pin on the large black relay on the left in this picture of the top of the board. Note there is no damage visible on the top of the board or on the relay itself.
iadom wrote:It would do no harm to isolate the heating element and give it an isulation test.
Where do I find it? What resistance should I see for the heating element itself?
iadom wrote: Its usually just the PCB although the water diverter can also blow the modules
What is this water diverter, and how can I check it’s ok?
Thanks again for your helpful advice.
January 17, 2012 at 3:26 pm #367357iadom
ModeratorRe: Siemens SE25M570GB not heating up – guidance sought plea
The heater box can be accessed by removing the right hand (from front) side panel. Resistance should be around 22? but good insulation is equally important.
I wouldn’t worry too much about the diverter motor, its on top of the heater box, well inside the innards.
Burnt out heater relay terminals are quite common on several makes of dishwasher, the fault usually lies in the solder/relay joints alone.
January 18, 2012 at 9:56 am #367358withanee
ParticipantRe: Siemens SE25M570GB not heating up – guidance sought plea
iadom, The heater’s resistance and insulation resistance check out ok, so I’ll order a new circuit board and trust that will cure the problem. Thanks again for your help.
January 18, 2012 at 7:23 pm #367359leavemetogetonwithit
ParticipantRe: Siemens SE25M570GB not heating up – guidance sought plea
You could quite easily repair the circuit board, preferably by sourcing and fitting a new relay or get any competent local electronics person to do it for you.
Mike.January 20, 2012 at 8:28 pm #367360withanee
ParticipantRe: Siemens SE25M570GB not heating up – guidance sought plea
Just to close out this thread, I fitted a replacement control module supplied by Siemens and all is now working properly as before. Note that Siemens only supply the pcb as part of the full control module, which includes the plastic casing, button link-arms & display.
I think it’s quite likely the board could be repaired as the previous poster said, but I couldn’t afford the time to find a repairer and wait for it to be fixed. I would also probably have had a nagging worry as to whether the repaired board would last.
Thanks to all for the help and advice you have offered.
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