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I spoke to a customer on saturday about a fridge freezer repair,told said customer that we had a call out charge and after a bit of hesitation they asked me what i thought may be wrong with the fr/frz i explained that i thought it would be thermostat and gave them a price .The customer said if it is thermostat they would go ahead as it would be worth it ,sent an engineer out this morning who confirmed it was stat ,customer then says Thank you we will think about . Somewhat surprised the engineer says ok it will just be the call out charge then ,customer says that they were never informed of a call out charge(100{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} certain i told them myself) and refuses to pay after a heated discussion the engineer leaves with out payment .The question is how far do you take these things ,write it off as a bad job or send them a bill anyway and ultimately take them to court your thoughts guys please Cras.
Re: collecting your call out
IMO, depends whether you and your engineer think the customer is trying to pull a fast one or if they just have learning difficulties.
Mike.Re: collecting your call out
This is a case where a nationwide blacklist of customers would come in handy.
George
collecting your call out
Allsorts wrote:This is a case where a nationwide blacklist of customers would come in handy.
George
And be totally illegal in this country. If you want to blacken someone’s name you will need to get the approval of a County Court.
Now I ask how many of you check the registrar of CCJ’s BEFORE going out to you customers?
Exactly, so an illegal blacklist if customers is as much use as a chocolate teapot.
The real lesson, if you have a call out fee, take it up front before you call, genuine customers do mind, chancers like the one above will call you back when they carny get anyone else to fall for their scam.
Jackal
RegardsRe: collecting your call out
Very often taking a call for a job in a certain street or district can often ring alarm bells about the chances of getting paid. Beyond that most obvious fact, it’s best to get an assurance of payment first before commitment. You stand to lose little just standing in a kitchen chatting about a fridge stat provided of course you haven’t done a 30 mile round trip to get there!
Money up front is not an option and on a pure legal footing could be construed as “taking money with menaces” anyway. The, pay me first or I won’t come and look at it, is so wrong on many levels when dealing directly, one to one, with your customer. Not least by flying in the face of the Supply of Goods & Services Act (1982) Maybe fine with landlords and letting agencies perhaps and best confined to that area of your business.
Re: collecting your call out
Martin wrote:Money up front is not an option and on a pure legal footing could be construed as “taking money with menaces” anyway. The, pay me first or I won’t come and look at it, is so wrong on many levels when dealing directly, one to one, with your customer. Not least by flying in the face of the Supply of Goods & Services Act (1982) Maybe fine with landlords and letting agencies perhaps and best confined to that area of your business.
Your out of your depth and talking rubbish again Martin.
Payment up front is perfectly legitimate and valid, We as a company do it all the time, have never had any problem whatsoever. We handle around 1200 calls a week, do significant amounts of work for numerous Trading Standards and I personally, am a Court approved expert witness and consequently we are inspected regularly. Our business practises are well known to Trading Standards including the payment up front requirement on cash calls, in fact when the local TS direct a query our way, they warn the punter that they will have to pay my call out fee up front. Are you suggesting TS are assisting me break the law?
So payment up front is Demanding Money with menaces is it, a Criminal Offence under the Theft Act of 1978, punishable by inprisonment for a maximum of 15 years!
Well try buying a new car and paying for it on the day you get it, see how many car dealerships will do that. Try going to a fast food outlet McDonalds, KFC (other establishments are available) and having the items served before paying for it. I doubt many establishments will do it.
Or if you prefer a more general example, try buy something on line or via ebay and getting it delivered before you part with the money.
Or alternatively, how do you think Pay as You Go Mobile Phone Contracts, or Prepayment Gas/Electric services work?
Here is the said Act you mention Martin, please, tell me where does it say you cannot take the money up front for a Service?
Part II Supply of Services
12 The contracts concerned.(1)In this Act a “contract for the supply of a service” means, subject to subsection (2) below, a contract under which a person (“the supplier”) agrees to carry out a service.
(2)For the purposes of this Act, a contract of service or apprenticeship is not a contract for the supply of a service.
(3)Subject to subsection (2) above, a contract is a contract for the supply of a service for the purposes of this Act whether or not goods are also—
(a)transferred or to be transferred, or
(b)bailed or to be bailed by way of hire,
under the contract, and whatever is the nature of the consideration for which the service is to be carried out.
(4)The Secretary of State may by order provide that one or more of sections 13 to 15 below shall not apply to services of a description specified in the order, and such an order may make different provision for different circumstances.
(5)The power to make an order under subsection (4) above shall be exercisable by statutory instrument subject to annulment in pursuance of a resolution of either House of Parliament.
13 Implied term about care and skill.
In a contract for the supply of a service where the supplier is acting in the course of a business, there is an implied term that the supplier will carry out the service with reasonable care and skill.
Implied term about time for performance.
(1)Where, under a contract for the supply of a service by a supplier acting in the course of a business, the time for the service to be carried out is not fixed by the contract, left to be fixed in a manner agreed by the contract or determined by the course of dealing between the parties, there is an implied term that the supplier will carry out the service within a reasonable time.
(2)What is a reasonable time is a question of fact.
15 Implied term about consideration.
(1)Where, under a contract for the supply of a service, the consideration for the service is not determined by the contract, left to be determined in a manner agreed by the contract or determined by the course of dealing between the parties, there is an implied term that the party contracting with the supplier will pay a reasonable charge.
(2)What is a reasonable charge is a question of fact.
16 Exclusion of implied terms, etc.
(1)Where a right, duty or liability would arise under a contract for the supply of a service by virtue of this Part of this Act, it may (subject to subsection (2) below and the 1977 Act) be negatived or varied by express agreement, or by the course of dealing between the parties, or by such usage as binds both parties to the contract.
(2)An express term does not negative a term implied by this Part of this Act unless inconsistent with it.
(3)Nothing in this Part of this Act prejudices—
(a)any rule of law which imposes on the supplier a duty stricter than that imposed by section 13 or 14 above; or
(b)subject to paragraph (a) above, any rule of law whereby any term not inconsistent with this Part of this Act is to be implied in a contract for the supply of a service.
(4)This Part of this Act has effect subject to any other enactment which defines or restricts the rights, duties or liabilities arising in connection with a service of any description.
Martin, stick to what you know best, Twin Tubs and Sloping Fronts and let those of us qualified by having actually studied for years to obtain that first class honours degree and therefore the right to stick LLB after our names do what we do best.
Jackal
Re: collecting your call out
Also, correct me if i am wrong, but Verbal Contrats are legally binding are they not. So court summons for the call out should be issued.
Re: collecting your call out
Jackal wrote:Your out of your depth and talking rubbish again Martin. ……………Martin, stick to what you know best, Twin Tubs and Sloping Fronts
Dear, dear Jackal,
It’s aways nice of you to offer such good and sound advice to me and to go to such strenuos efforts in putting your point across in that way. Your first class honours degree does you great justice and I bow to your learned expertise.
Sincerely
Martin
DrDill wrote:Amazing what you find out here!
How very true. 😀
Re: collecting your call out
Jackal wrote:
Allsorts wrote:
This is a case where a nationwide blacklist of customers would come in handy.George
And be totally illegal in this country. If you want to blacken someone’s name you will need to get the approval of a County Court.
Now I ask how many of you check the registrar of CCJ’s BEFORE going out to you customers?
Exactly, so an illegal blacklist if customers is as much use as a chocolate teapot.
The real lesson, if you have a call out fee, take it up front before you call, genuine customers do mind, chancers like the one above will call you back when they carny get anyone else to fall for their scam.
Jackal
RegardsYou know what I meant.. lol..
I meant an informal list of surname & postcode of the offending non-payers or takethepissers to forewarn others… It is not illegal unless you give either the full name or full address.
Although I do take your point about who could be bothered to check a list.
George
Re: collecting your call out
This is a sticking point for many, how to collect your fee, The truth is that most of the time your customers will pay you for your honest work and opinion, a small number will not pay, how you deal with this small number depends on what is involved. In the case of attending a client, taking into account your expenses and time to further the clients problem and no parts being fitted, the sum is presumably small. That in itself would not be worth the costs in pursuing in my own view, annoying yes of course but nonetheless not worth the bother. Its a numbers game in that most will pay some now and again will not. For instance we give the same spiel to all customers when placing a call, that can be subject to misunderstanding on the customers part or thats what they may try and make the hapless engineer on site believe.
We always arrive at the clients home, ask what the problem is, take a interest in their problem BUT before anywork takes place a discussion about the costs then takes place face to face with the customer to avoid any such misunderstandings with the client being advised that you will need to pay me on completion of the work or for your estimate.
In the case of a estimate and they still refuse to pay then theres not a lot one can do, but if we had fitted parts and reassembled the appliance and they refused to pay then that introduces another element into it.
Re: collecting your call out
It is nice to see engineers charging for call out in this trade – as there are still many who do not
Barry
collecting your call out
I agree, and find charging a fee sorts out the dross, I charge a few that I will knock off the repair cost, that way if they don’t go ahead I have at least covered my costs.
Sent from Steves
iPhone using TapatalkRe: collecting your call out
Im ashamed to admit that i never used to charge a call out until i started reading posts on here regarding busy fools ,and realised i was one :rolls: , i changed over to charging for my time over two years ago now and can honestly say things have never been better ,i should have done it years ago ,it certainly weedles out the wasters and i now have more time to concentrate on my better quality customers . 😀 Cras
Re: collecting your call out
Cras wrote:I spoke to a customer on saturday about a fridge freezer repair,told said customer that we had a call out charge and after a bit of hesitation they asked me what i thought may be wrong with the fr/frz i explained that i thought it would be thermostat and gave them a price .The customer said if it is thermostat they would go ahead as it would be worth it ,sent an engineer out this morning who confirmed it was stat ,customer then says Thank you we will think about . Somewhat surprised the engineer says ok it will just be the call out charge then ,customer says that they were never informed of a call out charge(100{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} certain i told them myself) and refuses to pay after a heated discussion the engineer leaves with out payment .
Reading the OP again, I would be inclined to wonder if this might be all down to misunderstanding. It may be that the customer doesn’t really understand the concept of “call out charge”. However simple it may seem to you and I because we work with it every day, many customers may not have a completely clear understanding of the term’s meaning. And let’s face it, the meaning can vary a little from company to company.
Also, I have to admit that telephone conversations are quickly erased by my memory and I sometimes arrive at a job to be surprised by the brand or the fault I am faced with 😳 . Even if I have written everything down, I probably won’t have all the info with me. So I can’t really get too annoyed if there is something the customer didn’t remember about a two day old telephone conversation.
When customers see me having these difficulties they understand that I, like them, am human and this gets the relationship off to a good start! They also get the impression I must be extremely busy and feel lucky I’ve fitted them in.I don’t usually charge anything until the job is completed. You get a feeling about people who are going to be a problem from the moment you pick up the phone and by the time I’ve actually got to the job and met them I’m usually pretty sure what sort of customer I’m dealing with.
Charging up-front before even calling announces the fact that you mis-trust everybody.
I prefer to give people the benefit of the doubt.
Mind you, I can understand people who travel 20 miles to a job, spending ££’s on vehicle expenses as well as time in traffic jams… I guess it’s horses for courses.
Mike.
Edit: I must make it clear that I do charge a call-out charge (only £25 including 1st half hour’s labour -yeah, yeah, I know too cheap but I don’t have many overheads 😀 ) and I make this known to customers on the phone if they ask or if they sound like they might worry about it.
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