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Re: Baubles
Long term, the aim of the WTA is surely to present a respectable, balanced and active alternative to the stasis of DASA. That it is currently seen as the political as opposed to the provisional wing of one group must be a long term objective to be resolved.
Chris.
Re: Baubles
Yep, can’t argue with that first sentence.
The thing is that the WTA has its role and its place just as does the general opinion of any in the trade which can be freely voiced within the forums. Both command the same respect in my eyes and both will operate in their own sphere with, I suspect, the general will voiced openly largely dictating the direction of the TA and, in my view, that is the way it should be.
To a large extent you can then hypothesise that if you lose the base opinion then you also lose the direction of the TA as well as UKW in general. This is the very thing I could see happening if it were chosen to “neuter” the opinions in any way. It is therefore plainly stupid to start talking of censorship in any form other than that already in place and applied in the interests of decency (generally).
Now, neutering, censorship and misdirection, I wonder where I’ve seen that before…
K.
Re: Baubles
Penguin45 wrote:Long term, the aim of the WTA is surely to present a respectable, balanced and active alternative to the stasis of DASA.
Someone will have to run that by me again someday, in words of two syllables or less please?
DASA indeed maybe somewhat inaffective at present, that is true. History has shown it to have had a great impact on the trade as a whole as many within this WR can assimilate no doubt. Now based on all I have read throughout this ‘baubles’ thread, open, honest, uncensored is the way forward apparently? Tell it like it is, formulate opinions and all that UKW stands for input into a new all embracing TA?
Does that mean then that all it’s members can have their shout? That the ‘Council’ will then accumulate the groundswell of opinions expressed and take issue to address them?
(I still have a problem with associate members but I’ll leave that for another time.)
I wonder what take Ruddi has on the D&G’s incentive scheme anyway?
So many questions?….meanwhile I’m off to my room and will try to drum up an argument with myself. 😉 :stir:
Re: Baubles
If the WTA is to represent the trade formally, it will have to decide to take a position on issues as they arise. UKW will, no doubt, continue to raucously debate the issues openly for all to see.
That I hope, will be the difference. Somewhere down the line, you have to pick a position and fight for it. Adrian has already moved one project forward. Early days, but it has started.
Baubles are nice for those who pursue them, but not important in the great scheme of things – still a good stick to shake from time to time.
Martin – I just don’t understand where you’re coming from, half the time. A lifetime in the industry, steeped in UKW from the start, yet it’s always the negative waves. I just don’t get it.
Chris.
Re: Baubles
Penguin45 wrote:Martin – I just don’t understand where you’re coming from, half the time. A lifetime in the industry, steeped in UKW from the start, yet it’s always the negative waves. I just don’t get it.
Yes indeed Chris, a lifetime in the trade and steeped in UKW without a doubt. I would like to think that rather than visualising this trade of ours under rose-tinted glasses, I can add a certain element of reasoned argument rather then falling headlong up a possible blind alley.
My arguements have puzzled many and for the greater part been shot dead in the water by successive rounds of buckshot, from all directions, time and time again. I would like to think that in order for anything to proceed and succeed it has to look at all angles. From both sides of the house even, using parliamentary terminolgy. 😉
I’ve said my bit under this thread and at the same time have passed on the thoughts of others in the same vein. Some have been upset by it others simply puzzled by it and Ken has given his reasons why it came about – fair enough.
I’m done on the subject except to add that (addressing Ken now) When you add the line “my own opinion” it is taken as a generalised term for that of the opinion of UKW and the WTA as a whole. And everyone that agrees says so by posting a reply, those that don’t agree say nothing and that fact is not only unquantifiable but also somewhat daunting IMHO 😉
Re: Baubles
I think many of the comments are unnecessary Marin and, very often, simply done for devilment. Also seemingly very often targeted at myself.
Who exactly has been upset and confused? You speak of this dubious and grey “they”, “them”, “people” and yet there is no-one asking anything or confused except one person thus far… you! Are all these “others” incapable of voicing their opinion or lifting the phone?
Asides from which all the points raised you raise in here, a closed forum with a very limited audience, what have you accomplished here? You have merely clarified it for yourself so far as I can see doing no “others” any favours at all.
Sorry Martin there’s more questions than answers in your reply here and little of any value that I can see in this thread offered to much of anyone else here as they understand it fully I’m sure.
But then you are offering opinion on contract work yet again, something that you know little about as you don’t do it.
Martin wrote:I’m done on the subject except to add that (addressing Ken now) When you add the line “my own opinion” it is taken as a generalised term for that of the opinion of UKW and the WTA as a whole. And everyone that agrees says so by posting a reply, those that don’t agree say nothing and that fact is not only unquantifiable but also somewhat daunting IMHO 😉
That’s the problem for “those that don’t agree”, not for me. As I’ve said before, if people can’t be ar$ed to communicate their opinion then neither I nor anyone else will take heed of this silent minority.
As for it being the opinion of anyone or any entity beyond me, again, that’s the problem of the reader and their perception of what’s written, not mine. And, if they are not intelligent enough to read what’s written correctly or then to have a snipe in private then that’s their problem, not mine.
K.
Re: Baubles
We are a bit of a closed community in here, and can I just remind everyone if you go back over this thread I did make mention that I beg to differ regards the statement that was put out in the Rumour Mill. In fact I lauded the point that it had evaporated.
Notwithstanding that point, and being of the mind that I did not endorse the statement, I thought it prudent to say so, and it looks like I got away with it! In fact I submitted 2 postings, and I’m pleased to say I was never taken to task. There lives healthy debate and respect for other people’s opinions and ideals, long may that prevail.
I doubt if any harm had been done, but strangely this debate seems to be getting lost in personal matters. I can see however that we could foster bad feelings among us as a group, please don’t let that happen. Not for me to say mind, as I expect there has been traffic I’m not party to, and perhaps I’m not qualified to comment. But looking at this in a detached manner, it looks like some things may be rubbing too close to the bone.
Can I just reiterate my view that we as a group need to command a bit of credence at times, regretfully that may mean prostituting ourselves and being a little circumspect? However there is fun to be had at having the odd pop at the outside word, but is it necessary for us to be snapping away at each other in here.
In the words of Marriott Edgar, “There was no wrecks… nobody drownded”
Can we leave it that way & move on.
Alex
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