DASA Again And The Current Position

[kwatt]

For Jason and Mark’s benefit I forwarded Neil’s email.

Okay so we now have Walter and Scott aware of the War Room and that worries me a bit if they’re bright enough to pick up on it. We need that to remain secure, if asked then I intend to tell them that it is an IRC channel that we use for discussion and if pressed I will admit that it exists and is secure due to the sensitive nature of the discussions there. Doubtless it would have been uncovered in time anyway but I intend no further discussion other than it is a council or people that I accept council from, that *I* choose on UKW and that’s my choice so tough. I’ll take the rap for that.

Next up, Chris.

I don’t think he’s gonna let go of the DASA cash cow as easily as you all imagine he will but that’s his call, not mine. I’m past caring at this point in time.

I have been “bearing with it” in regard to DASA for more years than I care to remember, I’m done with it! I wanted massive changes in DASA and it to move with the times, not be stuck in a 1950’s time warp anymore. And I can’t help but get the feeling that this upcoming meeting will be nothing more then the usual suspects nodding their heads for a bit and going away to do feck all as normal.

If DASA wishes to represent the trade at a government level then so be it, get on with it, but it will do so without me as there are far too many ground-level issues to resolve WAY before those that DASA has, in the 20 years I’ve been aware of it, done sweet fuck all about. It doesn’t want to take on the real issues of the industry, preffering to wallow in the tired old excuses of protecting us from legislation.

Well that worked with CORGI well didn’t it….NOT!!!

I’m sorry but it’s failed. It offers nothing to it’s members for their hard earned cash and it seemingly does nothing, even if it actually does do something then we are totally unaware of it as no fucker tells us about it!

So for my £200+ a year what do I get from DASA? Well, I get told I have to adhere to a Code Of Practice that cannot be upheld in a contractrual environment, I get told to carry out tests that I cannot afford the time to carry out, I get told to buy test equipment that I cannot afford to buy and I get the chance to pay to attend meetings in one of the most inaccessable areas of the UK by road and air.

Good start eh?

Then we have Chris, earning circa £24K a year from DASA which is partly MY money and producing…..

Well that’s the burning question really! 🙄

I have given DASA chance after chance to pull its head out of the sand and get with the program and it hasn’t happened and, when long standing members like me, Alex and many others start to turn away where’s the hope for it?

You know I sat for five minutes with the cursor hanging over the post button for this rant thinking “will I, won’t I?” but in the end I have decided that it’s time for DASA to put up or shut up. Produce results or die, thus far the massive decline in membership should be telling DASA it comes down to that choice and now, well, there’s just no value in being a DASA member as far as I can see.

K.

[kwatt]

Re: DASA Again And The Current Position

It was tres late when I posted the above and I’d had a few refreshments. 😉

That said the sentiment is valid and I still don’t see DASA going anywhere as seems to have no purpose really other than keeping Chris in a job and I’m not alone in that feeling. In all the years I’ve been a DASA member other than the sporadic, if not non-existant, Orbit publication I have had little information from it and nothing of any particular worth.

To go back into the mists of time I had a chat with the old man tonight asking him for his opinion of DASA, being the first Scottish member I thought he maybe had seen something that I’d missed. I was wrong, he hasn’t!

For 20 years hereckoned that all DASA had done was to win minor little changes to legislation and no more than that, so much so that he had considered dropping DASA on many occasions over the years the only reason that he joined was that, for agency work at the time, Candy insisted on membership. How times change eh? Not one contract has even asked if we are members never mind insist on it, which I think shows the regard that manufacturers etc have for DASA. In fact Graham Smye told me that only about 40{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} of the AIS network were DASA members.

So, how are we to turn that around? Is it even possible?

Without massive reforms I don’t think it is quite frankly and even if there were massive changes I don’t even know if it would work as the rot is so intrenched and opinions would take so long to change. I really feel that we’re trying to flog a dead horse, DASA has no power in the industry and is held in generally low regard with the exception of those involved in it.

But please, post an opposing view as I’d love to hear one.

K.

[Del]

Re: DASA Again And The Current Position

ken I’ll be there on wed so we will know for sure if it’s going to change or not. Then we can put our hands on our hearts and say at least some buggers tried to change things for the better and get some value for the money we’ve all been ploughing in over the years!
I for one am not prepaird to continue to contribute to what has become in all essence……. Chris Hayters life pension fund.

Sean

[kwatt]

Re: DASA Again And The Current Position

I have to say Del, I don’t see DASA as much more than that now either only in small parts is it driven by individuals to an extent. The Network DASA operation is a case in point, if it were not for Kevin specifically and to an extent myself it would never have gone anywhere, if it were up to Chris it would have been killed at birth. Here’s the thing that makes me chuckle about that…

We have a major change like that to DASA and what has Chris done to communicate it to the members?

There is a startling level of apathy in this industry and unless you take the bull by the horns and go about wakng people up you simply will not get anywhere. We even upset people on UKW and still it sometimes feels as if you’re slapping your head off a wall! 🙄

But anyway, I’m not out to kill DASA, I just cannot see any tangible benefit to being a part of it like so many others as it produces little or nothing for the cost of it. In fact the way I see it is this…

Chris gets paid to produce agendas and take minutes at council meetings and the AGM. He used to produce Orbit sporadically.

He deals with some admin, when he can be bothered and maybe answers the phone. However I’ve yet to call and actually get him!

He attends some meetings.

Ehm, after that I’m struggling to think of anything that I know that Chris does and I’m on the council and have a history with DASA.

So, he’s the main man as it were and he appears to be doing sweet feck all in effect and therefore any changes that we make to DASA, be they good or bad, will not be passed along to the membership as it’s blocked right there. Even with the changes mooted in Neil’s email the other night, has anyone seen evidence of these changes? Or are we to rumble on for another six months, a year or maybe two before it filters through?

At the current rate of decline in DASA funding and membership I doubt that it has that time left.

What has Chris done to promote DASA either to trade or public? Given a load of guys on UKW didn’t even know what it was speaks volumes! Mail shots are cheap and easy, using e-comunications is even cheaper.

Then, even if we did get DASA into some sort of viable shape you still have to convince the buggers out there that it’s worth spending the money on and I really do think that would be an uphill struggle.

There’s some points to think about.

K.

[admin]

Well Chaps yuo both know my feelings now, especially after Friday night.

Del has spoken to Neil and got a lengthy reply, personnally I dont agree with this and its time to change. Sorry t all those staunch DASA members but I maybe see more than most and it can not continue any more in the vane it is in.

[kwatt]

Okay so if there is to be a change what are we going to do about it?

I can’t see DASA folding in on Thursday but I can see a few of us going home early. 😉

I know we talked about UKW somehow replacing DASA and I still think it’s entirely possible to do that and produce a more modern and reactive industry force. If we’ve not done that already! However, if we are released for the shackles of DASA we can do so much more and, I think, for considerably less cost.

K.

[Alex]

Re: DASA Again And The Current Position

I’m looking at this with more than a little interest.

O.K. It can be said I may have started something, well if that comes up I will just point out that it was DASA that failed to stop something; or perhaps failed to get going even. Ostriches are not only indigenous in the African savannah it seems.

I wish I could be there on Thursday, but I’m sure there are people out there that will be speaking on my behalf. Just reading the ripple effect of all this speaks volumes.

Alex

[kwatt]

Re: DASA Again And The Current Position

Alex wrote:O.K. It can be said I may have started something, well if that comes up I will just point out that it was DASA that failed to stop something; or perhaps failed to get going even.

No-one is blaming you Alex, TBH this started a long time ago possibly years ago in fact. Your post, which was rather eloquent BTW, only brought many of the failings to the fore that’s all. The point being that you crossed the line and said what needed to be said in semi-public whilst others did the ostrich impersonation. I would have posted something similar, God knows I’ve thought about it, but I decided against it at the time as I’m sure it would have been seen as me trying to usurp DASA or at least that would have been the spin put on it when that would not have been the point at all as far as I am concerned.

But after Thursday the gloves may be well and truly off on that subject but I will not start without a general consensous here. If I do though, watch out DASA as I will tear it to shreds in some posts.

Alex wrote:Ostriches are not only indigenous in the African savannah it seems.

Oi, me luuuvvver is that you calling me an ostrich again? 😉

You are absolutely correct though and, even in here, we’ve had our heads in the sand for far too long hoping that a cure would miraculously appear from somewhere and that DASA would come good.

Well, I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings but it won’t happen! Either we do something about it, whatever we decide to do, or it will just trundle ever on as it has for the past twenty years or so.

Maybe you’re right Alex, maybe I have been an ostrich in that regard. 😕

K.

[Alex]

Re: DASA Again And The Current Position

kwatt wrote:

Alex wrote:
Ostriches are not only indigenous in the African savannah it seems.

Oi, me luuuvvver is that you calling me an ostrich again? 😉

Maybe you’re right Alex, maybe I have been an ostrich in that regard. 😕

K.

No you silly bugger, not you being the Ostrich, bloody DASA. They keep on ploughing their furrow, heads down totally unaware of the changing real world that is out there. All due I have to say by one person, that is bourne out by the postings subsequent to my protest. Action is long overdue it seems.

I know I have a clear conscience regards bringing this to the fore, it was so obvious that something is really wrong with the regime as it stands. After shelling out nearly £500 I started to wonder if I was alone, must admit though, I knew I wasn’t.

As I say, reminds me of 1970’s union meetings. The likes of Jack Jones, Frank Chappel, Sid Weighell and other old union leaders are long gone, lost in the mists of time due to the reaility of life and it is no longer beer & sandwiches in number 10.

Best of luck to all on Thursday, wish I was able to be there.

Alex

[Dave_Conway]

Re: DASA Again And The Current Position

Alex wrote:Best of luck to all on Thursday, wish I was able to be there.

Yes I would like to repeat that sentiment, staff holidays prevent me from going sadly. But you never know, I may decide at the last minute to get up at 4.30 am and drive up, we’ll see 😉

Dave.

[kwatt]

Re: DASA Again And The Current Position

Alex wrote:No you silly bugger, not you being the Ostrich, bloody DASA. They keep on ploughing their furrow, heads down totally unaware of the changing real world that is out there. All due I have to say by one person, that is bourne out by the postings subsequent to my protest. Action is long overdue it seems.

😀 I knew that, but it was a good enough excuse to wind you up a bit. 😉

I do agree with the sentiment though I have to say, I do think that DASA has gone in only one direction for far too long and I also think that, like an oil tanker, it may well take too long to change course. That said, the removal of Chris may well be the only way to try to bring it back on course, I simply don’t have the answer to that one. However, there is still the problem of entrenched believes (be they right or wrong) about DASA and it’s functions.

Alex wrote:I know I have a clear conscience regards bringing this to the fore, it was so obvious that something is really wrong with the regime as it stands. After shelling out nearly £500 I started to wonder if I was alone, must admit though, I knew I wasn’t.

No you were not alone and still are not I don’t think, there seems to be a lot of people unhappy about DASA for varying reasons, one of the most prolific is CH!

Alex wrote:As I say, reminds me of 1970’s union meetings. The likes of Jack Jones, Frank Chappel, Sid Weighell and other old union leaders are long gone, lost in the mists of time due to the reaility of life and it is no longer beer & sandwiches in number 10.

Na, it’s curry on a chuffin’ boat these days! 😆

Seriously though I know what you mean, I was a shade taken aback by the formality of it all etc, seems a bit OTT for what it is but then I’ve never been involved with and totally abhor unions. Not a typically Scottish view I know but I like to qualify myself as one of the more progressive of my fellow countrymen in terms of politics and social issues. I’ll drop that little bombshell one day in the open forums and give the manufacturers a fright. 😉

There is no need for a union, only commercial pressures brought to bear in the right places IMO. Which is where I think we’ve gone already with a few things and it appears to be working to some degree with rates being dragged up, so we must be doing something right.

Alex wrote:Best of luck to all on Thursday, wish I was able to be there.

Luck is not needed I don’t think…

A flack jacket would be nice though! 😉

K.

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