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Sorry Ken but I have mulled over and over the issue regarding the trades general apathy and complacency to your ground-breaking innovations, new projects and forthcoming training initiatives such as we spoke over today. So much so that I want to put it to the lads here in this forum to chew on and give us the benefit of their wisdom.
For this whole thing to succeed we need to be positive and under no circumstances show any, or even hint at any, negativity!
The trouble is (and with the greatest respect at this point) you are not the best salesman in the world. In fact, I would possibly suggest you may come close to being way down the bottom of the league of good salesmen. Salesman sell without the slightest clue about what they are selling, they in fact don’t give a toss what it is! They know that unless they sell some, they are out of a job! Engineers on the other hand cannot help but put the technical issues into their sales pitch, to such an extreme many a time that it simply kills the sale stone dead!
OK so far (I suspect?)I’m teaching grandma to suck eggs are’nt I? (Maybe 🙄 )
If you want to sell something (anything) in this case an ideal? a future? a training programme? a washing wachine? or whatever, there must be NO negatives. 🙁 NO NEGATIVES! 👿
Put negativity into the frame at any stage in your sales pitch and what is the first thing you create?…….
….Doubt, followed swiftly on by uncertainty and confusion! In short, you have shot yourself and the deal you are trying to pitch, in the friggin’ foot!
As long as you continue to post negatives, then check your toes my friend, ‘cos otherwise you won’t be able to walk on to the next idea!
Dozens, scores, even hundreds of those you need on your side are reading this negative stuff (everytime they sign on, day in day out) and are backing off from it. They, after all know all too well the negative elements in this what is after all their trade. Give them some more and…you go figure it out?
A lot of money is riding on this as well you know, and many stand to loose more than you could possibly imagine. But by steadfastly staying positive the negative element does not exist. Everyone would sense the positive aspects of what you stand for and are trying to create and be fully and wholeheartedly supportive of such and willing to (what after all you are suggesting with Project X) invest in such an ideal!
Stop slagging folks off, they may seem complacent but they are reading all this and drawing their somewhat misguided conclusions from it all and signing off. Type stuff they want to hear, put on the sales pitch, you’re not telling lies (like salesmen do) after all 😀
Comments…..anyone?????
Re: Positive(+) beats Negative(-) every time!
Okay I’ll bite.
There is several schools of thought on this actually Martin and not just the sales propoganda that you may have been read or taught in the past. There is a new way as well which seperates the good from the bad, positives from negatives and makes a case for each. What this demonstrates is an impartiality and therefore implies honesty and trust by facing that which is a negative and using it for positive effect.
Think on it as reverse psychology marketing.
Today’s consumers and, especially a lot of the guys on here, are bloody smart cookies and so they’d see any poor take up or spot a chink in the armour. So I wanted to fire them up, show them the potential, encourage them to find out more and give them a kick up the ass at the same time. I achieved that.
But by facing up to the negativity in the first place we get to see where the problems are at an early stage and we can put them right, at an early stage. Or you address it in a revised method later. It doesn’t matter, but if you only ever get smoke blown up your ass then you think the world is a hunky dory place, I’m not that complacent or dishonest enough with myself to believe or pump that out to other people. I prefer stark reality.
Now, show me where that thread is negative now? It has actually sparked off a slew of positive posts, all of which are pointing people exactly where I wanted them pointed. And all from an honest comment.
As my old Gran used to drill into me, honesty is the best policy. Whether you like it or not and I always find that the result is always far the better for it.
K.
Re: Positive(+) beats Negative(-) every time!
Martin, you should know by now that the old maestro plays us all like a fiddle. He just dont care if we like his sales technique positive or negative. It’s just being ignored that bugger cant stand. 😉
Sean
Re: Positive(+) beats Negative(-) every time!
This may be a little radical….
If you are newcomer on this site and get trade access, it’s a damn good read. The tone of UKW is crucial IMO – discussions are open, frank, humurous, helpful. Advice is freely given, thanks are regularly received. I cannot see that a contra position in a discussion is in itself negative, as Kev says, “If we all agreed, we’d have nothing to talk about”.
However, there is little evidence to show the structuring of the site, the heirarchy of command and responsibility, UKW Ltd behind the site.
We need to make the position MUCH clearer in order for our average Jo to understand what is going on. I would not suggest that Ken changes his designation from “site admin” to “God”, but why not “Director” or even “MD”? Kev, DC and Sean to “Director”. This is no longer a standard, free wheeling semi-anarchistic forum site like so many others, this is a professional outfit, with business leadership, backing and goals. This side is poorly presented in the current site set up.
New forum perhaps – UKW Ltd? Outline of aims for the site, members, projects – anything that rams home the message that we are serious, organised and set on business footings.
Better still, change the whole layout of the thing. Punter logs in for a look at why the dial of his Indesit W is clunking round and is presented with what are currently the Public Forums, he can have a look. If he wants to post, he’s got to sign up – box says “Are you a member of the Trade?”. He isn’t, so gets to post in the Public Side of UKW. There is no need for him to even be aware of the trade side of the site. However, if we sign up Bloggs Domestics, he can choose when he logs in to enter the Trade or Public side of the new UKW site. Much cleaner and avoids confusion.
We have (I hope!) some money these days, so what I suggest may not be impossible. If we do it right we can free up space in what I suspect would become two interlinked sites, allowing each to run without worrying about random fallingoverness.
The site itself is the key to everything that we’re trying to acheive, so in some ways getting this right is the crucial point. Presentation is the next one from the professional position. Separate the XML to each half and the Public need not even be aware that the Trade side even exists. However, the effect of “UKW launches own appliances” as a headline in the Public Forums will be far more dramatic than the latest bit about whether Wpl is going to buy Maytag or not.
Overall, I think we’re going the right way. I can’t see that any sort of debate in itself can be negative. What I do think is that emphasis and clarity from postings, positions and posters is essential to the light in which we are viewed and that longer term a review of the entire site’s operations will be essential to our future.
Oh, don’t change my “moderator” status to “Hairyopinionatedshortarsewithpoweroflifeanddeathifyoudon’tsaypulltheplugfirst”. It probably won’t fit in the box.
Chris
Re: Positive(+) beats Negative(-) every time!
kwatt wrote:There is a new way as well which seperates the good from the bad, positives from negatives and makes a case for each. What this demonstrates is an impartiality and therefore implies honesty and trust by facing that which is a negative and using it for positive effect.
I’m biting my tongue on replying to this masterpiece of what I can only describe as ‘negapositivity’ from our exalted leader. 😉
Honesty, trust and impartiality are the watchwords of UKW to both trade and public alike and have been the key to its success. But let us put that aside on this issue, it is not what I am on about at all.
UKW Ltd has entered a different chapter now and huge sums of money and restructuring has been implimented to enter this next early phase. You have to sell this product, shedloads of the bloody stuff in fact. The presentation of your ideas and proposals at Sibson were jaw-droppingly good. They made complete sense and offered a extended future for all in the trade. It was a fantastic show and was for the most part selling itself to all in the room.
Followed on by front page announcement to the trade, which surely got them thinking? Loads of page views, many and varied questions from all followed. The happy band of followers immediately signed up to the idea (all 25 or so that is 😕 ) Then the post deriding the apathy of those that did not respond, in so doing vertually admitting to all that this project is not taking off so good after all. That the trainers are getting an ear-bashing from certain elements of the business out there even! It’s not painting a good picture and the sceptics will love this.
Del wrote:Martin, you should know by now that the old maestro plays us all like a fiddle. He just dont care if we like his sales technique positive or negative
Don’t I know it Sean, as I said earlier, there has to be no negatives in selling. And ‘truth and honesty’ bit does not enter into this area of discussion. Salesman do not lie, they simply are economic with the truth and in so doing actual succeed in selling. Give a washing machine to an engineer to sell and he immediately will start spouting crap about the size of the bearings and the durability of the motor. Whilst the customer doesn’t even know it has a motor or cares for that matter….Too much information = NO SALE!
UKW Ltd has got a long way to go on this, Kevin positively oozes a passion for selling and is straining at the bit on this. I would love to hear word from the straight talking Yorkshireman as to if he reads any negative posts?
The futures bright, the futures ORANGE (oops sorry 😳 ) WHITE 😀
Re: Positive(+) beats Negative(-) every time!
Martin wrote:The futures bright, the futures ORANGE (oops sorry 😳 ) WHITE 😀
The future’s mapped barring any little hiccups.
Brand name within two weeks, fully sorted.
Appliances in December.
Site re-design January (estimated)
The rest I’m not telling.
Negative stuff is fine IMO and people respect you more for honesty than stringing them along. I don’t know what you’re so bothered about anyway.
K.
Re: Positive(+) beats Negative(-) every time!
kwatt wrote:I don’t know what you’re so bothered about anyway.
:duck:
Just voicing my concerns Ken, make of it what you will, why should I be so bothered eh? 🙄
Re: Positive(+) beats Negative(-) every time!
I do read the posts Martin. Regards the Pos and Neg issue, you have some valid points to make, as has Kwatt.
I think that in open debate you are both entitled to your opinions and your differences.
I don’t see negatives as such when it brings to the fore “debate”, no matter how you address the apathy, it is there.What Kwatt can’t say is what were doing about it. Roughly, less than a third of Repairs@ members have filled in their details, leaving around 60 who haven’t.
The applications are going extremely well, coverage is already good and we have another angle to go at with an unexpected offer yesterday.
I don’t get as passionate as Kwatt about the apathy bit, because when we are ready to approach and sell the Project X to those who have not responded, I’ll be doing it along with Sean. We will deliver to schedule our mapped areas and are fully prepared for our task.
Frustration at everyone not joining within the first 5 mins is what drives Kwatt. Its good for him to be brought down to earth, that not everyone can see the wood for the trees, it brings out the thinker in him and that’ll do for me.
We have it covered, no sweat.Kevin.
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