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Re: WEEE & Recycling
Fairdeal wrote:The whole goal for this scheme is that we should recycle the appliance instead of dumping them.
Well, not quite it would seem.
On asking the DTI et all for some clarification it appears that if you truly recycle, as in recondition then resell, then that does not count as part of fulfilling your responsibility towards WEEE. So if you break it up, crush it down and then reuse the materials, that’s WEEE satisfied. If you actually truly re-use/recycle then you don’t meet the obligations.
As I’m sure you can appreciate I think this is just utterly and absolutely insane. It totally defeats the whole point of legislation supposed to help the environment.
In all honesty the whole WEEE thing seems to me to be a sham.
K.
Re: WEEE & Recycling
Hi all,
The impending WEEE directive is being implemented because of the high rate of poor domestic appliance manufacturing.There are far too many machines comiing from China that are poorly manufactured and the fact that the manufacturer does not care how long the appliances last.This coupled with the different materials and hazardous substances that the appliances have.
It is the manufacturer/importer that will be held responsible for the recycling of there WEEE,a company called Valpak have been awarded a government contract to oversee the implementation of th WEEE directive.They have also been handed 10million pounds from manufacturers and the big retailers to distribute to L.As to upgrade there Civic amenity sites(this equates to approx £6000 per site in uk).
Each year every manufacturer will pass data to Valpak to assess how much there obligation is.So as far as i can tell you all the Weee directive is to make the manufacturer/importer responsible for there Weee.Whether it works or not remains to be seen.P.S.From the amount of Weee collected there has to be 15{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} fed back into the re use market.
Re: WEEE & Recycling
Hi Cooky,
It’s not as simple as that I’m afraid. The WEEE legislation, or at least how it will be implimented is an absolute minefield I’m afraid and, if you talk to any of the re-cyclers like Create, Remploy or others you’ll get a different opinion from each one as to how it will pan out. Even government cannot give definitive answers to simple questions on implimentation, we know, we’ve been talking to them directly.
Valpak is the retailer scheme pretty much, Repic is the producer scheme.
£6000 is a drop in the ocean compared to what the CAS actaully require to handle the waste, tehy’ve said so and I’m sure I published that news on the front page a few weeks ago.
There is not only an obligation from the producers, but also the retailers.
If you want more clarity on WEEE talk to John, he’s living and breathing the thing. 😕
K.
Re: WEEE & Recycling
I’m sure I have read somewhere that if you collect a machine from a customer (or take the defective part with you as you leave a completed job) you would need to hold a Waste Carrier’s Licence and have a designated way of disposing of the product. (both at your expense, of course).
If that is true, then that has huge implications for us as a trade. I can’t even get into my local council tip with hedge cuttings because I brought them along IN A VAN….!! :eeek: :eeek:
That means if you change a Hotpoint WMA tub half, being plastic, (and the “wrong type of plastic” for Dorset) you may have to keep it and leave it to your kids as a family heirloom!!!!
I take my dead machines (not fridges) to the local scrap metal merchant at the moment – does that avenue cease to exist under WEEE?? Does anyone know?
98{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} of my customers are completely unaware of any such regulations being implemented; even the ones using Ecover detergent. :snigger:
It confirms my belief that the government collectively couldn’t run a bath let alone a country like the UK. :rolls: :clown:
Some clarity is URGENTLY needed!!!Steve.
Re: WEEE & Recycling
A waste carriers licence is not that expensive, I obtained one recently. Simple procedure, cost £140 for three years, better than one hefty fine for taking an empty cardboard box away. 😥
http://www.environment-agency.gov.uk
Jim.
Re: WEEE & Recycling
Hi Jim,
What should we do with that license.How do we dump the washing machines with that license? Do we have to take washing machines or fridges to the recycling centres or would the wholesalers will pick up from us or the someone else will pick it up?
Also does giving machines to metal scrap people come into safe recycling?
It will be helpful if someone outlines a guideline for us so we understand it fully.
Regards
OmarRe: WEEE & Recycling
If you apply you get quite a bit of useful info. I don’t uplift full machines but do remove WMA drums complete to refurbish. I find it easier to do this in my garage than in the customers kitchen. I used to sneak the old rear halves down to the local council tip but they have become very watchful recently and I decided it was not worth risking any longer. With the licence I cannot take my scrap to the local facility but to a designated yard in Rochdale about 3 miles away that is authorised to accept trade waste etc.
The fun bit is deciding what six digit European Waste Catalogue (EWC) code your waste comes under. The list is rather long. 😉
http://www.cornwall.gov.uk/media/pdf/q/ … alogue.pdf
I think I will use 16 02 14 or should it be 16 02 06 or even 20 01 36. 😕Jim.
Its my understanding that these regulations are aimed and specifically to be financed by manufacturers i.e if you are a ‘producer’ if you manufacture, import or re-brand electrical and electronic equipment (EEE).
As part of any good environmental management system they should carry out a life cycle assessment of their product and list its impact upon the environment, reduce these impacts and ultimately dispose of the product at the end of its life……so they will bare the cost by adding it at the start…ie purchase price….this will increase the cost of an appliance significantly and also make the prospect of repair more viable…..who collects calculates the money etc as already discussed is a minefield….but a similar exercise has already been going on for a few years regarding packaging waste…….certificates are obtained at the end of each year (easily calculated from a manufacturers bill of materials) as a percentage of recycled cardboard….im sure this is what will happen but with placky, metals etc….
Spuddy wrote:Its my understanding that these regulations are aimed and specifically to be financed by manufacturers i.e if you are a ‘producer’ if you manufacture, import or re-brand electrical and electronic equipment (EEE).
Unfortunately not. Any of us who sell appliances is responsible, see http://www.dti.gov.uk/files/file32482.pdf chapter 1, para 2.
The same document explains that [or rather my understanding of it is that] the retailer/distributor who supplies the new machine has to either remove the old machine foc or explain to the customer where he can dispose of it foc at a designated site, and that this is in force now. Perhaps somebody can correct me if that’s wrong; I’ve not spent time reading through the myriads of documents about this .
Re: WEEE & Recycling
I thought it might be helpful to post this info on this thread. It is from the finalised form of the regulations and pretty much cover a retailers obligations.
PART 5
DISTRIBUTOR (includes Retailers) OBLIGATIONS AND RIGHTS: WEEE FROM PRIVATE HOUSEHOLDS
Take back
31. A distributor who supplies new EEE to a person shall ensure that WEEE from private households can be returned to him free of charge and on a one-to-one basis by that person, provided that any such WEEE—
(a) is of equivalent type to, and
(b) has fulfilled the same function as, the supplied equipment.Return
32.—(1) A distributor may return WEEE from private households free of charge to the system that has been set up by an operator of a scheme that has been approved under regulation 41 for the purposes of complying with that operator of a scheme’s obligations in relation to WEEE from private households under regulation 22.
(2) For the purposes of paragraph (1), “system” means a system that an operator of a scheme has set up—
(a) in accordance with regulations 24, 25 and 26; and
(b) under regulation 39.Information
33. A distributor who supplies new EEE shall make information available to users of EEE in private households on—
(a) the requirement on each member State under Article 2 of the Directive to minimise the disposal of WEEE as unsorted municipal waste and to achieve a high level of collection of WEEE for treatment, recovery and environmentally sound disposal;
(b) the collection and take back systems available to them;
(c) their role in contributing to the reuse, recycling and other forms of recovery of WEEE under these Regulations;
(d) the potential effects on the environment and human health as a result of the presence of hazardous substances in EEE; and
(e) the meaning of the crossed out wheeled bin symbol shown in Schedule 4.Record keeping
34.—(1) A distributor to whom the obligation in regulation 31 applies shall maintain records of the number of units of WEEE from private households returned to him under that regulation.
(2) A distributor who returns WEEE from private households under regulation 32 shall maintain records of the number of units of WEEE from private households returned by him under that regulation.
(3) Each distributor to whom the obligation in regulation 33 applies shall maintain records of the information made available under that regulation. 25
(4) The records referred to in this regulation shall be kept for a period of at least four years commencing on the date on which any such record is made and shall be made available to the Secretary of State on demand.
Exemption for members of a distributor take back scheme
35. Where a distributor is a member of a distributor take back scheme, he shall be exempt from complying with the requirements of regulation 31 and 34(1) for the period during which his membership of that scheme subsists.Part 6 – Miscellaneous
Prohibition on showing the costs of financing the collection, treatment and environmentally sound disposal of WEEE from private households
40.—(1) Subject to paragraph (2), no person shall show a purchaser at the time of sale of new EEE the costs of financing the collection, treatment and environmentally sound disposal of WEEE from private households. 26
(2) A producer may show a purchaser at the time of sale of new EEE the costs of collection, treatment and environmentally sound disposal of WEEE from private households that arises from EEE put on the market before 13th August 2005—
(a) in relation to EEE within category 1 of Schedule 1 until 13th February 2013; and
(b) in relation to EEE within categories 2 to 10 of Schedule 1 until 13th February 2011.
(3) The costs mentioned in paragraph (2) shall not exceed the actual costs incurred.
(4) A person shall be guilty of an offence if he intentionally obstructs any producer from exercising his right under regulation 40(2).To summerise – a retailer has:-
(1)an obligation to provide information (literature?) to customers explaining the benefits of recycling WEEE etc and their right to have the retailer remove the old equivalent appliance (Take back).
(2) To provide ‘take back’ free of charge and transportation of the WEEE to a recycling operator.The retailer then has the right to dispose of this appliance free of charge to the authorised operator who then assumes responsability. From this point the recycling is supposedly financed by the producers / manufacturers of the WEEE. The retailer is also obliged to maintain records of all WEEE that he ‘takes back’ and of information (literature?) supplied, for a period of four years.
There are no special licences required for the transportation of WEEE to the recycling facility and a retailer is not obliged to remove WEEE that is considered unsafe (dealt with in other sections).
Although it does not appear to be covered in these regs, presumably a customer has the right to decline ‘take back’, ie. they might want to retain the machine for reasons of their own. In this case it is probably advisable to have a customer sign documentation to this effect.
Hopefully the local authorities will handle most WEEE through the established civic amenity sites (when they eventually agree on the finances) so the only extra burden upon the small retailer will be the transportation of WEEE and the provision of literature (unless you want to join an expensive scheme to have it done for you!)
Anyway, this is my understanding of these regs but please correct me if i am wrong. All in all i think the directive is a necessary evil as it cannot be right to waste resources in the manner that we have in the past, but the consumer will again be the one who foots the bill. Hopefully it might make the manufacturers mend their ways and build machines with a degree of longevity and cost effective repairabilty.
I cannot understand the stance that some manufacturers have taken with the low pricing of appliances and the high pricing of spares which has forced the market into it’s present state. I suspect that the real culprets are the large retail stores who need to sell a steady stream of cheap short lived appliances in order to maintain the high turnover in sales that they require to sustain their large overheads.
From the manufacturers point of view if spares are priced reasonably and appliances are made to be repairable then this will generate a market for them in spares which could be potentially more lucratative than the initial sale. As we all know from days gone by most customers will opt to repair rather than replace if they feel the cost is reasonable, hopefully the costs to the manufacturer of WEEE may help them to re-evalute their position.
Andy 😀
Re: WEEE & Recycling
That list doesn’t seem to include what can only be described as ‘trade waste’ That is to say scrap drums, motors, the cardboard boxes they come in etc,etc.
It only appears to deal with the supply of new, complete appliances and the removal of the complete old one.
I have discussed this with the Environment Office responsible for this area and was informed that should I wish to take such scrap items away, or dispose of them, I would need a carriers license and would also have to take them to a designated disposal tip, not the local council amenity.
Jim.
Re: WEEE & Recycling
Jim, what about scrap yards? These are not going to disappear and usually they will pay for scrap metal.
Re: WEEE & Recycling
Hi Andy, I am talking mainly about WMA rear drum halves, and if you read the legislation carefully, the moment you put these items back on your vehicle you are transporting recycleable waste, with or without a license. I know that the £140.00 I have spent makes me feel safe from the jobsworths that will have a field day when the WEEE directive kicks in for real.
You can take a motor to a customers house, but even the box itself becomes recycleable material the second you take the motor out of it. You can leave the motor with the customer but if you take it away you are then transporting recycleable waste 😥
Jim.Re: WEEE & Recycling
This is typical bureaucratic nonsense gone totally overboard that will actually work against the objectives that supposedly they are trying to achieve.
In my area they started to charge for special collections of unwanted articles washing machines, sofas etc. after about two years they had to drop the charge and make it a free service again because people were just dumping stuff anywhere. It was costing them more to clean the place up than to just collect the stuff. I can see a similar thing happening again because of excessive regulation such as you describe. For instance, you can not transport the motor legally so you leave it with the customer who may just dump it or throw it into her wheelie bin where it will probably end up in a land fill site.
Pen pushing idiots that live on a different planet to the rest of us
Unbelievable!
Re: WEEE & Recycling
I’ve been looking into it and as a retailer this is how i see the WEEE regulations will affect us. It affects everyone who sells WEEE, including service guys who will have to dispose of faulty parts etc. Retailers will have 2 choices. Manufacturers (and re-badgers – expect to see lots of “no-names” disapearing) have different obligations, they have to pay for the recycling of old WEEE
1. Join Valpak for £750 (depends on turnover, covers 3 years and goes up to £1500 after 15th March). This then allows you to direct customers to the local tip, as I do now for free! You wont be able to do that on 1st July unless you are a member. This gets rid of your WEEE obligation to take appliances back in store. Apparently the money collected by Valpak (who are not for profit and are the only company set up by the goverment) will go towards refurbishing tips.
2. Dont join just register that you wont be joining, you are then obliged to take back all WEEE on a like for like basis. It is then up to you to store it and then take the WEEE to a collection site where it will be recycled (funded by the manufacturer)And i also guess…
3. Do nothing and hope for the best until consumers get wise and force you to take back old appliances!!This link from BIFFA is very helpful. http://www.biffa.co.uk/files/docs/Trans … 007_RO.doc
Quote from the above
Every retailer selling electrical goods, no matter how small a part of their business, will be required to register and contribute to a central fund or offer free in-store take back from implementation date on a ‘like for like’ basis. Unlike the Packaging Waste Regulations, Charities are NOT exempt.
The government expects retailers to have responsibility for ensuring that there is an ‘adequate network’ of facilities that allow consumers to be able to dispose of their WEEE free of charge. At the moment, household waste recycling facilities run by local authorities form the backbone of the existing collection infrastructure, but a significant proportion must be upgraded, which raises a need for investment. In addition, the government may require further collection facilities to be provided on retail parks.
The government has contracted out the operation of the Distributor Takeback Scheme to Valpak which will take responsibility for raising the necessary funds from EEE retailers – approximately £10m – and using them to establish an ‘adequate network’ of facilities. It is expected that this will mostly be based around the Civic Amenity site network, but it is possible that the scheme would have to operate additional facilities where local authorities were not prepared to participate.
As an alternative, a retailer will be able to offer in-store take back for all categories of WEEE sold in their shop. They will be entitled (along with distributors) to free disposal if they deposit any items brought back by consumers at a Designated Collection Facility determined by a Producer Compliance Scheme.
WEEE received by stores will be counted as their own waste and will therefore not lead to sites requiring a special licence.
Retailers will also have to provide information to consumers on how to dispose of electrical waste, either through the store if they operate take back or through the compliance scheme.
Distance sellers (e.g. internet distributors) face the same responsibilities as shop-based retailers.
I would suggest everyone visits https://www.valpak.co.uk/dts/ to see what it costs/involves
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