Getting on my nerves ;)

[Dave_Conway]

Right, let’s get this sorted once and for all as to be quite honest I am totally fooked off hearing it.

Martin has PM’d me tonight (which I won’t reproduce without his permission) regarding a number of trade members who have contacted him regarding the age old argument of “too much information” given to the public, especially (apparently) moderators.

Gegsy’s post here in particular is mentioned:

http://www.ukwhitegoods.co.uk/modules.p … highlight=

So…..

It’s OK for me to give part numbers, technical information (quite often copyrighted) etc to trade members saving them countless hours and money but UKW gets slated at every corner for telling Joe P to pull the plug but you may want to look at this part of your machine.

Frankly, I’m sick of hearing it and we need it sorted here in this forum please 😀

Dave.

[kwatt]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

Changed the topic slightly so as not to encourage others. 😉

My reply to Martin…

kwatt wrote:It comes up over and over. TBH I’m sick explaining the position on it, it’s there to read if anyone cares to do so.

Quite simply, the person that’s going to have a go themselves is going to do it regardless of what we say as they “know better”. Advising them to be safe, showing that all is not as simple as it first may appear and then giving the solution in the form of repairs@ is about as much as we can do.

But let me ask this one simple question, before UKW was here how many people would “they” (those that are concerned) have seen of people on the phone or standing at a spares counter asking exactly the same questions?

You cannot protect a business in the way that they think they can and they are in fact doing more harm then good by being obstructive.

Another one for you, how do these people think of the manufatcurers that won’t give them the info let alone customers?

I should hazard that there’s a bit of pot screaming at the kettle going on.

Digest that first.

K.

[Dave_Conway]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

That’s so close to my intended reply it’s uncanny 😯

kwatt wrote:Changed the topic slightly so as not to encourage others

Fair enough 😉

UKW is here to further the cause of the independents plain and simple, I’ll put a reply to my post the other morning (which may have been a slight knee jerk ;)) tomorrow 🙂

Dave.

[Penguin45]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

Not again……

So, are we assuming that everybody of any import has access to this forum and that as a consequence we will develop a definitive position statement?

I assume (sorry Martin) that Martin is receiving these complaints as he offers little practical advice and emphasises the repairs@ facility, whereas the evening shift tends to be a bit more forthcoming? No-one’s grumbled to me!

I should point out that the Oz forum is entirely run on the “fix-it-yourself” principle. My call-out charge might be rather steep.

Chris.

[gegsy]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

My post jesus, I only asked the fukker to check the brushes, how is that too much info. They want to get a life.
I reckon its targeted at me because I do my moderator job a bit too keenly or I have grated them in some way, so what , we arent here to be liked, get over it 😀

Greg

[kwatt]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

Oh I am so tempted here…

And since this is a private forum I think I’ll indulge myself. 😈

In short there’s feck all secrects to protect, if the poster has a bit of common sense and the ability to use a test meter then most older appliances are a piece of p**s to put right. Get over it.

99{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} of the faults we see daily are easily diagnosed and put right.

However the vast majority of people out there either can’t be arsed to do it for themselves or are just totally incapable of doing so. Let’s face it a washing machine is hardly rocket science.

If people don’t get the answers here they’ll simply moce on to DIYnot or whatever looking for a solution from people that know bugger all and there’s then no chance whatsoever of a conversion onto repairs@. I’d rather have 1 in 100 than 0 from 0.

Meanwhile we’re the good guys. The manufacturers, who won’t give us the info, are the big bad corporations, thereby making repairs@ still more appealling to consumers.

Okay, so every now and then one of these people may well buy a part from us, but I’ll tell you this… our spares turnover is not 1/1000 of eSpares etc. Not even close to that. So benefit to Dave and I or UKW… bugger all.

I’ve perhaps witnessed a dozen occasions where the info has gone too far, in almost 100,000 posts I don’t reckon that’s bad odds at all. In the meantime I’ve seen over 8000 repairs@ requests. Again, not exactly bad odds is it?

I think that “they” ought to get a grip, look at the actual numbers and re-think with the knowledge to back up what “they” are whining about.

Closed loop businesses are doomed to failure or strong critisism – FACT! I could go on all night chiming off examples and in the end its fruitile anyway as somebody always finds a way to circumvent the loop, just as we have with fault codes to the trade. But even beyond the sheer bloody stupidity of that, hiding secrets is hardly the way to earn people’s trust is it?

To be perfectly blunt, until someone comes along with cold hard facts showing that the advice on UKW is affecting their business more than they gain through repairs@ then I will remain totally skeptical and simply assume it’s just moaning for moaning’s sake without either grounds or proof to support the argument.

On the other hand we get emails all the time telling us how good we are, how people appreciate the support and compliments about the guys from successful repairs@ jobs.

Don’t take it personally Gegsy, you do a damned fine job as do all the mods and I wouldn’t change any of you. If anything you guys serve as ambassadors and you often surprise me as to how bloody good you are at doing that.

So, if anyone has a problem with this or with the system, the advice given then send them to me. The buck stops here. I’m more than able to defend any UKW policy and I don’t want a “he said, she said” type sh1tty situation. I will deal with it if anyone contacts you with this crap.

You guys have enough to do without this sh1te.

K.

[Penguin45]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

I wouldn’t take it personally Greg. It’s probably the cumulative effect. This gets brought up every few months in the trade forum, which isn’t really a problem – it’s all out in the open.

Chris.

[gegsy]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

Thanks for those comments but If they have a problem with any of us, mods that is; giving too much info blah blah, why not contact Ken or Dave and leave poor Martin out of the equation. It just seems that they want to go through indirect channels to cause effect.

Greg

[kwatt]

Personally I want these people to come out into the open rather than hide, I don’t get that at all it’s free speech on here after all. If they think they have a strong enough case then let them do it I say, I’m up for it.

K.

[kwatt]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

gegsy wrote:It just seems that they want to go through indirect channels to cause effect.

Quite, it’s hardly as if we’re hiding!

K.

[Penguin45]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

Oh, well – open the debate in the Trade Forums I suppose. Again. Can we finish it with a “Mission Satement” then sticky the bugger.

Chris.

[kwatt]

No, let the people with a gripe open the debate if they wish to do so.

I’m not getting into a p1ssing contest with these people less I have to do so as it’s liable to get heated (again) and I have better uses for my time frankly, like cutting my nails.

TBH I view the whole debate as a load of unsubstantiated crap with no real evidence or cause for concern. It would appear that a few people, very few, have a problem with it adn so be it. As I’ve said before, dont’ answer the public posts then or take part… your call.

I’m still trying to work out what bearing that the many US forums have on this that go into great detail, various mailing lists, newsgroups and other forums have on this debate.

Short sighted stupid cyclic arguments without justification and feck all research.

Before you go into a debate be sure of your facts, quite evidently the “they” are not and are only looking at one entity, UKW. Without proof as stated in a previous post I will not change how we do things as I think we’re right.

I also wonder how many jobs that these people have gotten from the other channels of information?

Totally idiotic.

K.

[Penguin45]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

All very true Ken.
I feel certain that a great number of our members don’t really realise or appreciate what they are a part of. This is normally a UK top 20 site if I remember the old posts correctly and it’s the public that do it – so we need to keep the public forums rolling in order to maintain the interest of our sponsors at the very least. After all, where did our trainers come from and what would the trade do without them?

I’m pretty tee’d off with the whole thing to be honest.

If we’re not going to have a debate, it may be an idea to work up a “Statement” in the future, just to re-emphasise what UKW is all about.

Chris.

[Dave_Conway]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

Penguin45 wrote:So, are we assuming that everybody of any import has access to this forum and that as a consequence we will develop a definitive position statement?

Probably not but as the “complaint” was directed at moderators on this occasion it seemed apt to go this way 1st 😉

Penguin45 wrote:No-one’s grumbled to me!

Nor me directly 😕

I wrote:Gegsy’s post here in particular is mentioned

Sorry Greg, I wasn’t meaning to pick one in particular, that was the post that was specifically mentioned to me 😉

I wrote:I’ll put a reply to my post the other morning

Which is this one:

http://www.ukwhitegoods.co.uk/modules.p … ic&t=15740

Penguin45 wrote:I’m pretty tee’d off with the whole thing to be honest.

Me too 🙁

I mean look at the time ! Sunday AM, can you tell this has been playing on my mind ?

Dave.

[Martin]

Re: Getting on my nerves 😉

Mornin’ gents!

Well I sincerely hope no-one lost any sleep over the subject?

This debate rears its ugly head once again and in past times I posed the question and posted the thread asking if ‘To much information’ was given. Those replies then might give you some indication as to who ( 😉 ) Pm’ed me on the subject again when I asked Dave the question: –

http://www.ukwhitegoods.co.uk/modules.p … ic&t=15740

The specific post that prompted the PM’s to me was Gegsys one about advising a punter to “drop the motor and change the brushes”. Now I too apologise in advance to you Greg and please do not take it personally. But ever so often posts such as this upset a hard core of trade members that are miffed that they don’t get a sniff from Repairs@!!

That’s it in a nutshell.

Now the reason that Dave, Chris, Greg and many other Moderators don’t get these PM’s of complaint is because they are possibly deemed as the guilty ones? I have been seen to show a more passive approach toward replying to the public and I always mention Repairs@ (99{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} of the time anyhow 😉 )

What does puzzle me a bit though is why the “To much information” thread hasn’t been used to bring the subject back to life?

http://www.ukwhitegoods.co.uk/modules.p … sc&start=0

Now in spite of the immense popularity of the site overall, it does rely very much on trade members support. It needs to retain that support to gain strength from it, as they want to gain as much benefit from it as they can. When a moderator is seen to be a little over enthusiastic with free advice its natural they get the hump. 👿

Don’t I know it – I’ve had it all slung at me in the past from all directions! 😀

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