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Having deliberated long and hard about replacing our 5 year old Whirlpool washing machine with another ยฃ3oo one, that now seem to be un-repareable and designed to last a few years and then be replaced, we decide to bite the bullet and go for an expensive and reliable model, eventually deciding on the ISE 10 due to the 10 year full warranty and good reports on this and other forums. However, less than 2 months in and it has twice stopped after the wash cycle, conditioner still in draw and clothes stuck in the machine wet and the display panel blank! On another occassion, the the end of cycle tumble failed to operate so all the clothes inside were press-formed to the drum! Whilst we’re not concerned about the machine, as its fully covered, we are somewhat dissapointed that faults of this nature are happening within 2 months! So Mr Whitegoods/ISE, I’ll be interested to hear what you think is happening with our machine in a very short time of us having it, or has anyone else had similar problems? – either way, we’re on to the engineer in the morning to sort it out! Also, whilst I’m in a disgruntled mood, we like to save energy by running the machine at 5am on Economy 7; however unless you sleep heavy (or eventually your brain blocks it out!) the machine’s cold water filling feature wakes us up – and we are upstairs well away from the kitchen where the machine is! – the high pressure filling on wash and rinse cycles reverberates through the house, surely something can be done about this.
Sorry about the rant Whitegoods/ISE, but you have some confidence building to do if you want us to turn our experience to date around.
Regards
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
Hi Remraf,
Sorry to hear you are experiencing any issues with a 10, it is very unusual.
If the machine sits for (if I recall correctly) more than about 40-60 minutes after there’s an issue then yes, the display will go blank as it goes into energy saving mode and shuts down. As much to save energy this also saves any excessive use of the LED display, it is a function to extend its life.
If the error encountered has cleared in that time then the machine will default back to work as normal allowing you to continue.
Have you actually seen this happen or is the machine always used totally unattended through the night on Economy 7?
Without a more information it’s difficult to speculate on the reason why the machine has stopped although the likely suspects are a failure to drain and suds lock given that it appears, from what you’ve said, to work again afterwards without a problem. I suspect that this may be the problem here from the information you’ve given.
Suds lock is a common thing on most modern machines with a digital (electronic) pressure switch. What happens is that there is too much detergent or you get items that act like a bellows in the machine creating too much foam. this foam gets into the pressure switch hose and hold the pressure, the machine drains out but the pressure switch is held open and eventually the machine times out draining thinking that there’s something preventing it from draining when, in fact, there isn’t. After a while the foam dissipates and the pressure switch is released at which point the error clears and all works as normal.
The simple answer to this issue is, as advised in the manual etc., to cut back on the quantity of detergent being used.
I’m not sure what you mean by the end of cycle tumble at all. So far as I am aware that’s an option not on the 1606.
As to filling, there’s not a lot we can do about the noise of mains water or your pipework I’m afraid. It can be restricted of course by turning back the tap to the machine or by fitting a restrictor but, the compromise is, that the machine wouldn’t fill as fast and that would impact the wash times adversely.
HTH
K.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
Hi Kwatt
Mrs Remraf here (Mr Remraf’s posting seemed untypically grumpy, sorry about that). Anyway, what you have suggested is a possibility – the machine would have sat for a while before we discovered the cycle hadn’t finished. Whether it is down to suds I don’t know, but it would be reassuring to know that it is not a fault, but a design feature. Before it goes into the power saving mode, would it be showing some sort of error code on the panel?
As to using too much powder, having read an article on UKWhitegoods site about powder and also how to look after your machine, I have reverted back to big box powder, using only the amount specified for our water (hard), but I will gladly cut back a bit and see if that helps. I also wash the machine once a month without a load in it on 95 degrees.
The tumble cycle referred to, is where the machine tumbles at the end of the cycle and the creases in the washing are less apparent. In all cases this seems to happen, but then on one occasion it didn’t leaving the washing well and truly stuck to the drum! It’s only happened the once, and it was on a cycle I use often so it was immediately noticeable.
The noisy filling is something we’ve read about elsewhere for the ISE10. As it has never been an issue with any other machine we’ve had, we’re assuming it is the design of the ISE10 and as you say, it cuts down on the wash times. I guess it’s finding the balance between what is acceptable noise wise versus length of wash. It is very noisy though! Does the machine drain quicker than other models?? Just wondering if that could be what’s causing the machine to stop?
Overall though, I’m very happy with the machine and it does have a quality feel to it. Let’s hope less powder does the trick.
Jane
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
Hi Mrs Remraf,
Yes, if there was an error it would display an error code that would give us a pointer as to what was wrong, it doesn’t always pinpoint the cause but it does offer a very good clue most often.
When any machine stops, for whatever reason and after a while clears itself and works as normal it will almost certainly be something like that which is the cause. Try as people might they still haven’t invented the machine that repairs itself, good thing for repairers.
The ISE10 is designed to use as little detergent as possible and it can be easy to overdose it. As I found out a few days ago when my better half decided to do a maintenance wash only for me to hear a holler that the machine was leaking….
The foam above the level of the door was a bit of a clue as to the problem! :rolls:
The worst of that little escapade is that she should have known better, a lot better, as I imagine she is most likely sick of my preaching about it. The incident has however given me justification to cast it up as required, just for fun.
If there’s a bit of overfoaming what I’d usually recommend, as I did, is to run the machine through an empty 60รลกC or higher was with absolutely nothing in the drum. If you get soap showing after the fill and a bit of heat then you know there’s residues in there, it’s the easiest way to see it. If there is soap, let it run through the cycle and it should clear the bulk of it, if not it all. If you don’t see suds then it’s okay to cancel the program and just use as normal. This applies to almost any washing machine although it’s usually much worse on plastic tanked ones.
The anti-crease thing I’ve not come across.
The filling is a little noisier perhaps because the ISE10 has a stainless outer tank, not plastic like most so you might be hearing the water on the steel. It may sound a bit hollow and with an echo, like running water I guess, depends on water pressure a lot really. I think that might be what you’re hearing.
That said, I’d take a stainless steel tank over a plastic one any day of the week, regardless of the noise as they are much, much more robust and far less susceptible to bacteria building up in the machine. You will never hear of a complaint about bad smells from a stainless of enamel tanked machine and you will rarely get one holed by a coin or whatever.
In fact, even in semi-commercial use I don’t think I’ve ever come across one that’s been damaged.
Plastic is quieter though, absorbs sound better, you just pay for the compromise a ways down the road. ๐
I’d try cutting back on the powder a bit and see what happens. Depending on the powder what happens is that, if there’s too much in there, the ingredients have nowhere to go and so just make foam. This effect is amplified with cheap powders which use low cost ingredients to make foam and make it look good and bulk up the weight, not necessarily clean as well. Couple this with large items, like towelling, bed sheets or the likes and it can be a recipe for lots and lots of foam, which really isn’t good and, as the manual says, it doesn’t actually do anything more for the washing either, it just costs more money and can give silly, annoying faults like this.
HTH
K.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
Our ISE10 is almost 2 and a half years old now, but has started to throw up error code F3 pretty regularly – once a fortnight, so that’s about one wash in ten. Any ideas why? Each time we check it for blockages, there’s nothing in the trap/filter. Draining the machine down each time is a nuisance, but I’m loathe to call an engineer out if it might be something simple.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
How is the outlet pipe connected? does it go directly into an open standpipe or is it connected to the undersink plumbing.
I have had several occasions when this has occurred and it turned out to be a small coin, button or similar object stuck in the very end of the grey outlet pipe or the connection it was attached to. It can act like a valve, sometimes allowing the water to pass through and at other times stopping the flow completely.
Its worth checking this first and if it is clear then you should send for an engineer.
Also worth trying to change or reduce the amount of detergent used, over soaping will also throw up this error code.
In my area which has very soft water I advise using a single tablet or half of the amount of powder stated on the packet. Also tell customers to avoid liquid detergents at all times.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
Not a plumber, so I’m not sure what an open standpipe is! But the grey outlet pipe feeds into a 4mm drainpipe that has a 30cm vertical drop, then a u-bend before connecting to the sink’s drain. The u-bend is clear, as is the end of the grey outlet pipe. I’m not able to check for blockages along the length of the outlet pipe as I can’t shift the washing machine right now, but that’ll be the next thing I check.
The other half insists that she’s not been using too much powder (or liquid – she uses pretty much anything that catches her eye on the supermarket shelves, it seems). Mre importantly, she’s not changed her washing routine since day one, but it’s only been in the last two months or so that the machine has been playing up like this, so there must be something wrong somewhere.
The impeller at the back of the trap – I can spin it for one revolution (in either direction), before meeting resistance, then another revolution before encountering resistance again – is this normal, or should it spin freely?
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
That movement is normal, it should ‘flick’ round in quarter turns. TBH you should always try to use a good quality detergent, I use Ariel tablets, both the green box ones for whites and heavy wash and the purple box ones for the coloured clothing.
I would never, ever buy another detergent just because it happened to be cheaper or whatever.
Has she been trying some of the new, liquid gels on the market, I had a call only last week on an ISE that had been fine until she started using the latest Bold liquid gel, it was flooding out of the soap drawer and leaving detergent marks all over the clothes.
If you think that all detergents are the same then you, or your good lady is mistaken, not that I would dream of telling her that. ๐ Just as petrol/diesel can vary dramatically in quality, so do detergents.
It does sound as though your outlet feeds into an open standpipe which is the best option and will be unlikely to be blocked in the way I described.
Are you in a soft water area ? If you are then try reducing the amount of detergent by 50{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} and if the problem still persists then it might be time to call for an engineer, if over soaping is not the cause then its likely to be an obstruction somewhere.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
rdewsbery wrote:The other half insists that she’s not been using too much powder (or liquid – she uses pretty much anything that catches her eye on the supermarket shelves, it seems).
That’s a huge problem in this industry.
People don’t understand the different detergents, don’t care and are faced with an often bewildering choice. It really is pin the tail on the donkey stuff to get it right at times as the detergent you use and, the amount has an utterly astounding effect on how your wash turns out and how well the machine will perform.
Think on it this way, although it’s not just as severe, if you put unleaded petrol in your diesel car it’s not gonna end well. Same thing, differing severity of result.
Buying whatever happens to be on a BOFOFF or whatever offer this week in Tesco will not provide consistent results.
Not all detergents are the same.
Not all detergents perform in the same manner.
Not all detergents will give similar wash results.
Almost every detergent on a supermarket shelf contains different ingredients.
Different detergents have differing levels of foaming agents.
And on, and on it goes…
Couple this with today’s ultra efficient washing machines and a small mistake can lead to issues either with the machine’s performance, the results you get or can even lead to causing problems.
rdewsbery wrote:The impeller at the back of the trap – I can spin it for one revolution (in either direction), before meeting resistance, then another revolution before encountering resistance again – is this normal, or should it spin freely?
Yes, it’s a magnetic pump and that is exactly the manner in which it should behave.
The F3 error is the electronics reading a failure to drain.
It does this by sensing that the pressure switch or pressostat has not detected that the water level has dropped below an acceptable level so as to consider the machine drained.
If you get an F3 error and the machine has drained but it works as normal thereafter then the only possibility is a suds lock, that’s it. Sorry if this seems a bit harsh but, there is no other possible explanation for a ghost report of a fault when it isn’t entirely evident.
If you get an F3 error and there is water still in the machine you have four possibilities:
- Something is stuck in the pump and has jammed it from operating correctly
There is some form of blockage in the drain hose or plumbing
The pump is faulty and not running
The eco/detergent recovery ball has stuck
Option one and two are not a fault with the machine.
Option 3 is, obviously.
Option 4 is invariably caused by continual low temperature washes with liquid detergent mainly and the absence of any maintenance wash to clear away the build up of scum but, again, not a fault with the machine.
It’s all very logical really. ๐
In essence, when we see this sort of error on any machine and not just an ISE10, there’s about a 1 in 10 chance that it’s actually a problem with the washing machine as such. And, if the pump goes faulty then it’s faulty period, they generally don’t self-heal or fix themselves, if they go wrong then that’s it, busted till it’s put right.
Hope all that helps and doesn’t confuse things for you.
K.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
Hard water (hard enough to stand a spoon upright in a glass, I like to say).
There’s no danger of her using cheap detergents. She likes brands. Not that she’s particularly loyal to any one brand. She also likes shiny new things – so yes, she’s been trying out the liquid gels. And now you mention it, she says that the problems started roundabout the time that she started using the gels. No doubt we’re seeing the problem intermittently as she still uses powder for some washes. So it’s probably that.
Any recommended short-term remedy (other than simply swapping back to powder)? Is it worth running the machine on an empty boil wash program to clear everything out a bit?
Thanks, by the way.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
A regular maintenance wash is always a good idea.
Do go back to powder or tablets, there is no bleach in liquids so nothing to kill off bacteria. Use up the gel in very small doses for coloured items.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
Yup, if you run it through a hot wash (60รลกC or higher) it should clear any residue detergent and, I’d lay odds you’ll see suds even running it empty which, you shouldn’t if all was well.
The problem is that when you put in too much detergent it can take months and months for it to show up as an error by which time everyone, quite naturally, assumes that what they’ve been doing is okay. But it’s just storing up problems for the future.
The ISE10 is far, far less susceptible to these issues than most as it has a pukka stainless outer tank rather than a cheaper plastic one but, when you do go over the score with detergent you can still get this to happen.
With liquids (and those damn gels) it’s much, much easier to overdose as the amount needed is so small, people think it’s not enough and lob in a bit more to get stuff “clean”. Works for the makers of the detergent, you use too much and buy more sooner when in reality, it’s not really needed and causes this sort of thing.
From the instructions on the packet though I would say, in my opinion, it is almost impossible to work out how much you should be using. You really have to suss it out yourself.
Like most of the guys on here that know anything about detergents I’d strongly recommend big box powder only. If you use a liquid, use a non-concentrate one and only for coloureds as no liquid detergent can contain bleach, period.
If you do that you can also pre-treat tough stains with the liquid which saves the need to be buying a chemistry set of stain removers as well. ๐
HTH
K.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
Thanks for all that.
If you get an F3 error and there is water still in the machine you have four possibilities:
Yup, that’s been the problem. Error and machine still full of water. I was taken by surprise the first time, and we had to do quite a lot of mopping up afterwards ๐
Something is stuck in the pump and has jammed it from operating correctly
Nope, seems to be spinning properly.
There is some form of blockage in the drain hose or plumbing
I’ll be looking at this if it happens again.
The pump is faulty and not running
Seems to turn fine by hand.
The eco/detergent recovery ball has stuck
Option 4 is invariably caused by continual low temperature washes with liquid detergent mainly and the absence of any maintenance wash to clear away the build up of scum but, again, not a fault with the machine.
That sounds like the fellow. Although the gels are fairly new to us, we’ve been using liquids fr ages – but last year, when our youngest was still in cloth nappies, the machine was regularly getting used at higher temps. If the recovery ball is sticking, how would the owner go about getting it unstuck? Though it seems that the first thing to try is to go back to our old powders. And I’ll not miss the gels. The other half has been wondering why several washes have been ruined with red dye leaching from something, yet everything in the machine had been washed many times before. I’m betting that the new gel stuff was the culprit there too.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
You are welcome, not a problem.
The ecoball sticking is a problem and has been for many years with all machines since everyone started using them to meet the EU regs in the 90’s. :rolls:
Its pretty much law as I understand it that these have to be fitted.
Interestingly, in commercial situations and some domestic ones, engineers have been known to “lose” the ball. Uses a little more detergent, power and water but you then don’t get any issue with the stupid things.
It’s a plastic ball in the sump, as the machine fills the ball rises and blocks the sump off. The idea being no detergent goes in there (green, more efficient we’re told) and you don’t heat the litre or so of water in the sump hose (green efficient so we’re told) but the problem is that if that ball gets a bit sticky due to scum or whatever, you get no drain faults. As repairers we then go out, test it and it works okay as it’s unstuck. Customer thinks we’re muppets as we can’t find fault… etc…. you see where this is going I’m sure.
The cure is regular maintenance washes to clear the gunk out, cleaning with the likes of Affresh and/or you stay well away from gels, liquids and any other marketing ******cks that these companies peddle as being supposedly “better”.
I’d do a maintenance wash, maybe, after a full on 90รลกC wash with nothing in the machine and I’d bet that cures the issues. On an ISE10, as it has the stainless tank and the 90/95รลกC wash is as close to a sanitisation wash as you will get in a domestic washing machine, one pass with that will probably cure it totally.
Think on it like a reboot. ๐
I can’t explain the red dye but, I’d expect it to be colour bleeding in all honesty.
K.
Re: ISE 10 problems already!
Sorry, I’m back (original poster) with the occasional problem still happening……. we have had a couple more occasions when our ISE10 has stopped. Last week I had set the machine going, after a few minutes went back into the kitchen to find it was not working and the time display was blank. Thinking I perhaps hadn’t set it by mistake I set the machine going again. A few minutes later it had again stopped and the display was blank. This was at the start of the wash, not when it would have been draining. Third time I set it going I stood watching it for about 15 mins and it continued to wash and completed the cycle normally. However, today the machine had again stopped, but I’ve no idea when in the cycle it had stopped. What I find puzzling is that you’ve said the time display goes blank to conserve energy, and yet when the cycle has finished END appears and stays lit for hours until you switch it off. It would actually be helpful if the display didn’t go blank after an error, after what must be a very short time, and then we may get a glimpse of an error code.
I have cut down to about half measures on powder (Ariel) and since having the machine have given it a monthly maintenance 95 deg wash.
I don’t really know where to go from here?
Irritating though this is, I will add that despite the niggle the machine is lovely. You really can tell it is a quality item.
Jane
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