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After hearing about so-called restrictive practices by Miele regarding their error codes I wrote an article which advised consumers it might be something they need to take into account when purchasing. After the guy at the last UKW meeting stood up and told us all that he encountered a Miele washing machine with a blocked pump filter and the error code would not clear I updated the article. Apparently Miele refused to tell him how to clear the error code and the customer had to get a Miele engineer out to do it.
These “facts” have been recently been refuted by “a Miele trained engineer” who says categorically that no Miele appliance continues to display any error codes after the fault has been cleared, and that the engineer must have been incompetent (my paraphrasing).
I don’t want to have any slanging matches on the thread but I do want to publish the truth and nothing but the truth. Basically I’m being told completely contradictory things so can anyone clarify the exact situation regarding Miele error codes (particularly on later machines) and do they or do they not need resetting after a fault has been cleared or do they as the engineer insists simply remain in diagnostics memory not visible to the customer?
I would really appreciate contributions on my actual article here – anonymous contributions are easy to do as there’s no requirement to put an email address or even sign up to comment. Many thanks.
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
Is it Groundhog Day or what Andy? You have asked this question BEFORE as I recall.:wink:
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
Indeed Martin, and no one added anything to the article. I need some backup on the comments of my actual article as it’s just me saying one thing and someone saying it’s wrong. It’s no use me keep quoting anecdotal evidence such as someone told me an engineer he knows had a problem. I need engineers to say I’m an engineer and this is the issue we have.
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
Point taken but just scanning through the TRADE TECHNICAL issues indies have had fixing Miele appliances and not one has said there was an issue with not being able to reset error codes. 😕
As far as I know user fixable errors can be easily reset by turning the appliance off, fixing the prob, then turning it back on again. Therefore I suspect replacing (say?) a duff heat, TOC or pump. Once the fault is cured the error will go away?
So perhaps you misunderstood what the guy said at the last UKW bash and that your later encounter with a “Miele Trained Engineer” gave a more rational explanation of the facts? 😕
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
On the latest Bosch washing machines you have to unlock the fault code after changing motor brushes. While you do not need software to do this you do need to know what buttons to press and when to turn the timer dial to unlock the code etc.
This information is not available to independent engineers as far as I am aware.
I would not be surprised if Miele use similar code locking practices.Graham
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
What was said at the meeting was that an engineer attended a Miele appliance with a blocked filter. The blockage was cleared by either the engineer or had already been cleared by the customer but the error code remained. The engineer telephoned Miele from the customer’s house and they said all they could do was send a Miele engineer to reset it. The customer apparently did so.
If this information is somehow incorrect I’d like to have it confirmed so I can remove the information from my Blog.
I’ve also been told by various reliable people on here that some error codes can only be reset by a Miele engineer. However, until the UKW meeting I’d not heard of it being applicable to something trivial and common like a pump blockage.
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
Why not phone Miele and ask Andy .
See you at the next meeting ?Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
After reading that tale on your blog, Andy, about the Miele filter, I relayed the tale to a customer because I wanted to discourage her from choosing Miele when it was not really appropriate to her situation. (I’m not a habitual reader of your blog so it must have been an idle moment when I managed to deviate from my UKWG addiction.)
So, I too would like to know the truth about this.
Mike.Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
There’s various reports. All uncorroborated as yet but there is a few that I can’t easily dismiss.
The chap that you’re talking about at the UKW meeting was no muppet Andy, he’s a smart cookie that knows what he’s doing. I’d have to presume that due to that and, the fact I know he’s not a muppet, pretty much tells it’s own tale.
Official confirmation of such practices? Seriously?
Would any manufacturer that was holding it’s customers to ransom stick it’s hand in the air and declare their guilt?
I think not.
K.
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
Thanks K. The Miele trained engineer contributing to my article comments is trying to portray him as incompetent as they always do. Unfortunately they do all seem to believe they are elite and everyine else is incompetent, which is a shame. I can understand why they might think that, and have confessed before that I too used to think I was the only good engineer and everyone else was a cowboy in my area when I was young. Until I joined UKW and realised how arrogant and wrong that attitude is.
I spoke to the guy in question after the meeting and I pm’d him after I added the information to my article to check that I had reported it accurately and to ask if he wanted to add anything or even comment himself. I never received a reply. I could have got the wrong guy but you’d have thought if so he’d have replied advising me I had the wrong guy?
I have emailed Miele’s chief engineer about this specific thing but have previously pointed out my article to him personally and asked him to correct any inaccuracies which he never did. However, it’s possible he just never found the time to read it – and this was before I added the anecdote regarding the pump filter error code.
I did, and still do find it quite a shock to learn an error code for something as simple as a blocked filter could remain after fixing and need a Miele engineer. It’s hard to believe they would be that daft, but so outrageous I had to put it in the article. If it is inaccurate in any way I need to put things right about it asap.
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
Hi Andy,
Could be that no-one wants to be named or put their head above the parapet on it? Dunno TBH.
I think what you’ve done is taken “reasonable” steps. You got wind of the practice, dug into it as much as you could, asked Miele to respond. There’s really not a lot more you can do without an official position from Miele.
I think the lack of any response probably tells you one of two things, either it’s true and they don’t want to comment or, they don’t think it’s important enough to comment. Either way, it looks bad.
There is of course a third possibility, it’s not there, yet.
I do find it very interesting what Turbo was saying about the Bosch machine though.
Just think, a few years time when nobody bar the manufacturer or their agent can repair a product offering a total monopoly on service including freezing out the actual owners from repairing things themselves if they so wish.
I don’t know about anyone else but, to me, that’s just not right.
K.
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
I agree with every word K. I just find it frustrating that no one seems to want to add their voice to such a publicly prominent article fighting their corner. I’ve said before no one even needs to enter an email address or sign in as I have anonymous comments activated. However, unless you are an actual Miele dealer or engineer what’s to be scared of?
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
Hi andy. I was a miele trained engineer and as far as i know they only store them in the memory so engineers can recall them. The machines should function perfectly ok once problem is sorted no need to delete but it will stay in the memory if you don’t which can lead to confusion if it develops another fault later because it will show that fault plus the new one although the first as been sorted.
But saying that i really have not had much in the way of dealings with the newer stuff (within last 2years but that should be covered by miele themselves) i can not see them locking up because it had an error code because they would be locking up every two minutes. There was always loads of error codes for silly stuff when you went into the memory from drain faults to oversudding, out of balance, low water pressure, etc etc so there own engineers would be running round like lunatics and charging customers a fortune for doing absolutely nothing if them locking up was the case. miele would not possibly do anything like that would they??.lol
Seriously though unless they have changed it on newer models it does not matter whats in the fault memory the machine should work fine as long as there are no problems. I can not personally speak on the problem the other engineer had and i am casting no blame or anything i did not see the job but it could of been a number of other problems blocked pressure pot, pump not pumping fast enough, module fault,slight blockage in drainage system etc etc anything really but one thing is for sure what ever the fault the pcb thought it was to slow to drain.
It is easy to delete the codes anyway you don’t need a laptop it can be manually done the same as most things miele there is usually/always a manual way of doing things in case the laptop goes awol but miele wont tell you that information perhaps some kind soul will pop up the information i really doubt it though! Unfortunately i have forgot the combination to enter the programming mode otherwise i would tell you.
As for miele engineers or miele employees your right most are arrogant for no real reason but there are some good ones real good ones and there are some bad ones very bad ones. But that’s just the same as anywhere. People always want to believe they’re the best it is just pomp because they work for miele miele are good machines so they automatically think they are good engineers it does not work like that in the real world though.
You wont get much out of the senior engineer or anyone else who works there they are all scared to say or do anything because they know they’re/everything is being watched/monitored and they will be dragged across the coals big time if they say anything in any public forum. I know loads who come on here but will never post anything because they are to scared. Hello lads and lasses hope your all well :waving:Phil
Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
kwatt wrote:
I think the lack of any response probably tells you one of two things, either it’s true and they don’t want to comment or, they don’t think it’s important enough to comment. Either way, it looks bad.
There is of course a third possibility, it’s not there, yet.
K.
If their machines are guaranteed for five years, sometimes ten, parts and labour*, then I suppose they have a valid reason not to release any info on any model for which the guarantee has not expired. To do so would encourage unqualified interventions which could complicate the work for company engineers and invalidate those guarantees.
(*Do I have that right?)
Mike.Re: Miele error codes – can you or can you not reset them?
Not really Mike.
Apart from the fact that it’s supposed to be published for treatment or reconditioning of WEEE I believe that the trade and public should be able to determine and clear codes for silly errors.
Soem of them mentioned by Phil above, such as OOB, no drain, no fill and things like that could just be a problem that the customer can put right themselves. Why should they be expected to pay whatever ransom is demanded for a simple thing they can resolve themselves?
Or even why should a customer have to call a manufacturer’s engineer to reset a machine just because they want to change the brushes themselves? It’s their choice to self-repair wether or not we, the manufacturer or whoever agrees, by having a system like that in place you remove the ability of the customer to do that. I can’t see too many people out there being overly happy if they find out a few years down the road that this is the case.
I don’t mind charging people for stupidity when they wash nails and the likes breaking stuff or dousing the cooker in water and so on but I’d have a real moral issue with charging to clear a code on a machine just because there was something in the pump that had been cleared by the customer.
I also think that (and this is the important one for me) not allowing other independent traders access to that information in order to allow them to repair the products in a restraint of trade and anti-competitive at best and, that’s me being very kind and very restrained with the comments. It removes consumer choice and eliminates competition, both of which the last time I checked, were considered to be illegal practices across the EU and in the US as well.
As has been said however by others, manufacturers in this industry often trade on a fine line between what is legal and what they can get away with. If it goes unchallenged and they get away with it the legality doesn’t matter in real terms.
K.
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