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Re: “You must be CORGI registered to work on gas”
Just got off the phone to Corgi. It IS ILLEGAL for any trade person to carry out ‘GAS WORK’ on any appliance without 1 – being certified competent AND 2 – Corgi registered. If Corgi are made aware of any repairer working on gas that are not registered, they WILL, in every instance, investigate and pass the case to the HSE for prosecution if the law is being broken.
I suggest that this person is either 1 – not actually doing ‘gas work’ or 2 – he is corgi registered. If he isn’t, for the sake of the safety of the customer, he must be reported. If Corgi take no action (which I doubt), I’m sure the press would would be interested in this case!!
Re: “You must be CORGI registered to work on gas”
i beleive there is a freephone number that corgi have setup to shop people who are carrying out work not registered. Bottom line is for all of us who pay and go up the right route why should other people get away with it.
Taken from the hse website……
In particular the Regulations require gas installation businesses
to be registered with CORGI, which is approved by HSE to maintain a register of gas installation businesses.
All gas fitting operatives are also required to be able to demonstrate they are competent to undertake gas work safely normally by being assessed against nationally accepted standards.Wether the person(s) is competent is neother here or there they should be regsitered like most of us are.
Re: “You must be CORGI registered to work on gas”
washdoctor wrote:Just got off the phone to Corgi. It IS ILLEGAL for any trade person to carry out ‘GAS WORK’ on any appliance without 1 – being certified competent AND 2 – Corgi registered. If Corgi are made aware of any repairer working on gas that are not registered, they WILL, in every instance, investigate and pass the case to the HSE for prosecution if the law is being broken.
I suggest that this person is either 1 – not actually doing ‘gas work’ or 2 – he is corgi registered. If he isn’t, for the sake of the safety of the customer, he must be reported. If Corgi take no action (which I doubt), I’m sure the press would would be interested in this case!!What they say and do are two different things, it wasnt long ago we were told that registration fee’s would help subsidise our annual membership fee, which then went up !!!
The person in question has been reported, his work checked and nothing has been done, if you read your “gas installer” mag you will see that they dont seem to want to prosecute anymore, they would rather get them corgi registered to get a fee off them every year.
Re: “You must be CORGI registered to work on gas”
The HSE/CORGI thing is something that I do feel strongly about. So much so I wrote a rather large free consultancy document for the HSE in relation to appliance repairers. Then I continued that through Frontline as part of the gas safety review last year. I then actually dragged my carcass to London, despite a deep loathing of the place, to talk to the suits including the CORGI head honcho.
The short of it is that they have recognised the need for a set of “limited scope” qualifications which would/should/will include our little corner of the world. Now, whether Frontline win and get their way or not (i.e. what everyone was telling them and the HSE) when balanced with people in wheelchairs in attendance that had suffered from CO2 poisoning remains to be seen. What’s paramount, safety or people that are qualified to ensure the safety? To which do you apply the most value?
I am waiting with bated breath the outcome of it all which, as usual with anything to do with government, takes an utter age to see what the outcome is.
But please don’t anyone say that we didn’t try to fight the repairer’s corner as, trust me, I most certainly did.
Now I see this as an area for the WTA to address. Whether I do it or someone else does is frankly an irrelevance, we need to close ranks and speak with one voice if you want to get anywhere with the HSE. It’s not CORGI you want to have a pop at, they’re just lapdogs for the HSE and just do the HSE’s bidding. Shockingly the HSE don’t understand the appliance industry, I’m sure that shocks many of you to the core but really, it is true.
(Who says sarcasm doesn’t work on the net ;))
As for being unregistered, I wouldn’t risk it. I don’t fancy spending some quality time with Bubba in a 6×6 room that has a poor view. Sorry, it’s just not for me, asides from which I’m told that they don’t let you online, so it’s just not my cup of tea at all.
CORGI prosecuting, not a chance. It’s the HSE that does that, if they have the funds to do it and the inclination it would appear as well as how much press they’ll get from it to justify their existence and budget. Oh dear, I appear to be being slightly cynical again, perhaps I’ll stop now. 😉
K.
Re: “You must be CORGI registered to work on gas”
kwatt wrote:CORGI prosecuting, not a chance. It’s the HSE that does that, if they have the funds to do it and the inclination it would appear as well as how much press they’ll get from it to justify their existence and budget. Oh dear, I appear to be being slightly cynical again, perhaps I’ll stop now. 😉
I think you’ll find that CORGI and the HSE have the legislative powers to prosecute offenders. After all that is their job and combining that with Trading Standards Office those who abuse the system will indeed be shown a 6×6 room! 😉
Here is a recent post I placed in the Part P thread just to show what’s happened this year in Hampshire alone : –
Prosecutions relating to Part P and CORGI work seems to be the up and coming thing now and Trading Standards have had greater powers of enforcement. Below is a copy of an article in this months Hampshire Trading Standards Newsletter: –
Hampshire Trading Standards wrote:
PROSECUTIONSIn the last newsletter we told you about prosecutions
brought against two traders following unauthorised
claims of Part P registration under Building Control
Regulations. We thought you might be interested
to hear about recent prosecutions brought by our
colleagues in the enforcement part of Hampshire
Trading Standards Service.—————————————————
In January Fareham Magistrates imposed fines of
£1100 with prosecution costs of over £850 on a
plumber who had falsely claimed to have fitted a
replacement pump and whose business stationery
erroneously claimed Bosch authorisation.
—————————————————-
In February Portsmouth Magistrates imposed fines of
£300 with costs of £250 and compensation of £280
to cover remedial work on a plumber who falsely
claimed CORGI membership and whose work was
dangerously substandard.
—————————————————-
In April Aldershot Magistrates imposed a fine of
£1200 with costs of over £850 on an electrician
who had falsely claimed to hold Part P registration
—————————————————-
Also in April at Southampton Crown Court
a plumber who had falsely claimed CORGI
membership received a 3 month suspended prison
sentence together with 100 hours Community
Punishment Order (CPO),
—————————————————–
In May at Portsmouth Crown Court an electrician
who had falsely claimed NICEIC membership
received a 100 hours CPO. He also had to pay
compensation of over £4000 to cover remedial work
and prosecution costs of £1000.
——————————————————
Complaints made against business who falsely claim membership of organisations such as CORGI
and NICEIC are always taken very seriously and
investigated by our enforcement teams. Likewise
complaints about false claims of approval or work
actually conducted.The sentences imposed by the Courts clearly show that
they share our concerns that such activities undermine
public trust and confidence in the trade sectors involved.kwatt wrote:Doesn’t say who brought the action though. 😉
Fair point! I will contact TS and get back to you on that… 😉
Re: You must be CORGI registered to work on gas!!!
As I understand it from the conversation I had with Corgi the other day, Corgi don’t have the power to prosecute. The only thing they have the power to do is investigate. If, after investigation, they find illegal work activities, they HAVE to pass the file / case to HSE to review for prosecution. It will then be the HSE that will start proceedings with Corgi as a ‘witness’. 🙂
kwatt wrote:Doesn’t say who brought the action though. 😉
I enclose the information as promised…….. 8)
Trading Standards wrote:Hello Martin,
Nice to hear from you again……..I trust you are well.The answer to your question is quite straightforward.
It is a criminal offence, under S14 of the Trade Description Act 1968 , for anyone in the course of a trade or business to falsely claim membership of any Trade Association such as CORGI or NICEIC (or one of the 1001 less well known organisations).
The false claim/description can be made in any way…verbally,in writing/advertising or pictorially by using a logo on their van.
It is also an offence for anyone to falsely claim that the services they provide have been approved or evaluated by any third party, or that they are able to legally offer services , such as the issue of Part P certificates, when they are not legally able to do so.The Trade Description Act is enforced by Trading Standards Authorities and anyone can make a complaint either to their own local TS Dept or to the office where the suspect trader is based.Alternatively complaints can now be made via the Consumer Direct system by phoning 0845 04 05 06.
We also ,of course, receive complaints direct from organisations such as CORGI.Prosecutions such as this are relatively straight forward………as long as the Trade Association is willing to give evidence that the trader is not a member (you would be surprised how some are reluctant to get involved!).
The more difficult ones are when the advert is in a long term publication such as Yellow Pages and the defendant was a member at the time of publication but has subsequently let their membership lapse, or have been booted out of the organisation……….we would/could still proceed in such instances but it would usually need additional evidence from a member of the public to say that they were misled by the advert and that the trader did not make it clear that they were no longer members of the organisation.There is a central register of convictions held by the OFT but this is not public information.
Cases are often reported in local press and I thought that CORGI sometimes published details in their magazine.The Trade Descriptions Act is being replaced next year by a new piece of legislation called the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2007 but the offences and enforcement will still remain the same.
Hope this helps,
Regards Rick.Richard Kerr
Principal Trading Standards Officer.
Hampshire County Council.
Trading Standards Service
Montgomery House.
Monarch Way.
WINCHESTER.
SO22 5PW.
So there we have it…. 😉Re: You must be CORGI registered to work on gas!!!
From what I can gather from the response that’s only if you claim to be a member of CORGI and aren’t.
The original query, so far as I understood it, was were you able to work on gas without being a member of CORGI which is a whole different question to the one answered by the above.
I think that you will find that, if you carry out gas work and are taken to task on the strength of that, that it will be done by the HSE and not some local council’s trading standards offices.
K.
Re: You must be CORGI registered to work on gas!!!
kwatt wrote:The original query, so far as I understood it, was were you able to work on gas without being a member of CORGI which is a whole different question to the one answered by the above.
Well jeremy answered the original query quite well I believe. 😉
But to reiterate the point if I may, under the “Gas Safety (Installations and Use) Regulations 1998”
It states : –
Anyone carrying out work on gas appliances or fittings as part of their business must be competent and registered with CORGI
The HSE are the enforcement agents and within their many reams of rules and regs I managed to pick up this….
Now my interpretation of that snippet of info is that if anyone that was not registered and is carrying out work on gas appliances ‘for hire or reward’ and had not done anything to compromise gas safety guidelines. Shall be sent a “Prohibition Notice” from the HSE. A kind of ‘Register with CORGI or stop future gas repairs’ type notification. 😉
The bottom line is that no-one, but no-one, can carry out repairs to any gas appliance for hire or reward that isn’t CORGI approved…period!
That includes replacing a blown oven bulb or fan element on a duel fuel cooker……..fact!!!!Those amongst us that have gone to the trouble and expense of getting a CORGI registration can relax in the knowledge that all such work is only open to them. And so it should be…….Live long and Prosper! 8)
Those (like me) that aren’t CORGI registered….DON’T TOUCH GAS APPLIANCES….EVER!!!!…..or you may be hearing from HSE (& co)? 😈
Re: “You must be CORGI registered to work on gas”
washdoctor wrote:Just got off the phone to Corgi. It IS ILLEGAL for any trade person to carry out ‘GAS WORK’ on any appliance without 1 – being certified competent AND 2 – Corgi registered. If Corgi are made aware of any repairer working on gas that are not registered, they WILL, in every instance, investigate and pass the case to the HSE for prosecution if the law is being broken.
I suggest that this person is either 1 – not actually doing ‘gas work’ or 2 – he is corgi registered. If he isn’t, for the sake of the safety of the customer, he must be reported. If Corgi take no action (which I doubt), I’m sure the press would would be interested in this case!!
Surely replacing a bulb isn`t “gas work”. This then becomes ridiculous. I was under the impression you could work on them as long as you didn`t break into the system.Have I been doing this illegally then? (not that I`m admitting I ever had :D)
Re: “You must be CORGI registered to work on gas”
bazza500 wrote:Surely replacing a bulb isn`t “gas work”. This then becomes ridiculous. I was under the impression you could work on them as long as you didn`t break into the system.
A complete misnomer Barry. The law clearly states GAS APPLIANCES….and the regulations stand, whether its a busted lightbulb or door handle needs fitting, you shouldn’t go anywhere near it if you’re not CORGI registered. 😉
Re: You must be CORGI registered to work on gas!!!
Yes Barrie, you can replace seals, hinges, bulbs etc. without being CORGI registered so long as you don’t break the supply or a gas carrying component.
I can see where dubiety lies from the picture above though. It would appear to indicate that the actions taken are assessed on a case by case basis based on how “competent” the installer appears.
TBH it appears to be a minefield with the easy answer being, don’t touch it if you’re not registered.
K.
Re: You must be CORGI registered to work on gas!!!
yes u can fit a door seal etc etc but what say if the flame picture from the burner is incorrect, are you able to identify it, are u able to correctly repair it are you able to serve a notice on the appliance if its unsafe etc etc, basically you have to treat the applaince as a whole and if ure not corgi registered and something goes wrong or is incorrect you were the last person to touch it! is it worth the risk?
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