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I have no knowledge of such a thing being on sale.
Can you give us a bit more detail on what it is you require?
K.
Re: heat pump tumble dryer
AEG developed a heat pump tumble dryer back in the late 1990s for a European competition to develop more efficient products. They are much more efficient than a standard dryer because the heat is cycled back into the machine rather than being exhausted out of the back or condensed in the water. These are the only realistic way of getting an A energy label rating – the White Knight 847 merely takes a long time to do it, but the heat pump ones can do it in a normal length cycle.
There are several other models available in Europe, including ones by companies called Ecodry, Elektrabregenz and Schulthess – although this brand seems to be non-domestic dryers. The retail price of these models is much higher than their standard counterparts, but I wondered if anyone in the ‘professional’ market knows of any of these entering the UK, either for domestic or non-domestic use.
Any info, links, sources etc will be gratefully received.
Best wishes – Nicola
Re: heat pump tumble dryer
Would it be described as anything else ?
I did a Google and apart from a couple of acedemic sites it brought up your post on here 😆
Dave.
No they don’t call them anything else, except for the European sites which have the translated words. I’ve Googled quite a bit on this, but wondered if anyone in the semi-professional area had considered importing them, or if any domestic ones have come in.
Best wishes and thanks for trying
Nicola
It’ll be down to cost then Nicola. If a manufacturer can’t see volume sales of a product happening then you’ve almost no chance of them seeing the light of day.
Then there’s the old cost to buy vs. cost to run argument to be had over the lifespan of the machine.
I now know what you’re talking about though.
Elektrabregenz do produce domestics but, so far as I am aware, they are not coming into the UK at the moment.
You mention the “A Rating”, don’t be too misled by those ratings as, whilst they indicate the use of power etc. on a single load, they tend to misleading in that the results and time taken to achieve that rating often do not meet with consumer expectations. 😉
K.
Re: heat pump tumble dryer
Have found this link which explains the operation of such a machine! 💡
Re: heat pump tumble dryer
Indeed Martin, a fascinating read.
From the context in the documnent (published in 2003) it looks to me as if it was all theory work and that there were no working models at that time.
Given the quotation of the Kyoto Accord I can but assume that this was instigated as a responce to that summit and that the object was to save energy. As usual however, whilst the author/s took into account the impact of electricity use of the domestic dryer and, to a degree, took account of the extra cost involved in the additional components to impliment such a system they totally ignored the environmental impact of the production of extra components, shipping and disposal. As gas filled products are more costly to dispose of and end of life.
I would expect, from an environmental point of view, that the additional factors involved would probably, if not totally, negate the benefits of the system to a large extent.
I can also see why, in a highly price sensitive market, that the manufacturers have shyed away from the product ignoring the fact that they will not be geared to produce it and that it is more complex and has more points o failure, therefore more likely to fail.
Just my thoughts on it.
Very interesting idea though.
K.
Re: heat pump tumble dryer
Re the cost to manufacturers etc of new products.
If they can do it in Switzerland, Austria and the Netherlands, why can’t they do it here?
What incentives would they need from Govt or through subsidies i.e (Energy Saving Trust, EEC funding) to do it?
Nicola
Re: heat pump tumble dryer
It probably would not be manufactured here in the UK at all Nicola.
There is only (to my knowledge) only two UK owned manufacturers left of any note, Crosslee and Dyson and both have appliances manufactured outside the UK, as we all know in the case of Dyson.
But consider this. If the heat pump dryer costs ~£400 and a standard condensor dryer only ~£170-200, who’s going to buy one in mass market terms? It would be a niche product I would suspect at best, as £200 buys the electricity that would be used over the life of the appliance in a standard machine thereby offsetting the additional cost to buy and negating any savings made in terms of electricity.
Then you have to consider that it’s unknown and unproven technology with no indication of the failure rate over the expected lifespan. So would they even go the distance? This is probably why you don’t see them for sale more than any other reason I should think as manufacturers simply won’t expose themselves to that kind of risk financially. Plus this trade, when it comes to product development moves at somewhere slightly shy of glacial pace!
As for the environmental argument I’d stand by my previous comments. I would also argue that the use of a washing line is by far and away the most environmentally friendly way to dry clothing, as well as the being generally accepted as the best method. House builders have also not helped the situation over the past few decades by omitting a true airing cupboard in modern builds.
It is therefore not, in my opinion, a viable alternative in real terms to a standard or condensor dryer as yet, but the heat pump could be a political winner by being “politically correct” on the face of it. Pity that politics and common sense rarely go hand in hand.
K.
Re: heat pump tumble dryer
Having downloaded and studied closely the PDF file (thanks to Martin 114) on the theory of the heat pump dryer. I cannot ever imagine such a device being produced in the UK and for the UK domestic market 🙁
Having first hand experience at the implementaion of heat pump technology used in domestic and commercial swimming pools. They are extremely expensive to buy, very slow and cost a fortune in electricity to run….only for the rich with big wallets.
The PDF file shows exactly the same principle being used only in a more compact form and presumably contained within a 600wide 600deep by 820 high cabinet?????????….impossible!!!! :rtm:
Martin
Re: heat pump tumble dryer
This actually has turned into an very interesting little exercise for me today.
I went to one of the electricity suppliers on the net that had a calculator on it which can be found here:
http://www.ukpower.co.uk/running-costs-elec.asp
Then on to Zanussi’s website and looked up the spec on a TD4112W condensor dryer and found out it burns 2700W per hour. You can pick one up for £150 or thereabouts but we’ll assume a cost of £200 for round figures.
To dry a load (5Kg) takes 55 minutes spun at 1400rpm (or above I presume) to get the load “cupboard dry”.
Assuming an average use of 20 hours per month with a cost per kWh of 5.5 pence this would incur a cost of £2.97 to run such a dryer per month for the 20 hours of use.
If the the increase in cost is about correct for the HP dryer, same scenario almost as I was discussing a few months ago about the gas dryers by the time you add the installation costs, bringing the total cost to about the £400 mark. You end up with an approximate £200 difference in cost to buy which, in pure electricity usage terms would give an additional 1346.8 hours of running to the Zanussi before the purchase price of the HP machine was justifiable. Based on the average of 20 hours a month use this is over five and a half years worth of use.
Even if the heat pump reduced the energy consumption by half, which I doubt in the real world, it would still not be an economically viable proposition to an “average” family.
Rough figures but I’m sure you get the point, but marketing and playing to people’s desire to be seen to be green often negates the actual real world reality. The EU’s ECO labelling system is not ideal IMO as this shows if they rate that dryer as an A class.
K.
I think AEG already gave up this product.
Heat pump clothes dryer should be a very good product.
I don’t know what is the problem about their product and why it costs so much.
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