Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale :(

[nomadPaul]

Can i ask what the theory is behind the running of elements with the earth disconnected for a few minutes ? Is it to clear the element of moisture in some way ? Its not soemthing i’ve heard of before….and Graham , is this what you mean when you say your supplier bakes them ?

[clivejameson]

nomadPaul wrote:Can i ask what the theory is behind the running of elements with the earth disconnected for a few minutes ? Is it to clear the element of moisture in some way ?

:tup:

[cornflakes]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

I would rather he did run earth free for a period and meggar again, but no he puts a batch in the oven and raises the tempreture to around 200, if you were ever around when using PYRO in the 60’s/70’s then a similar trick was used to clear moisture prior to making off termination. you run a fag lighter over end of cable to remove dampness, elements are made very similar.

alright you are not getting shiney parts, but when you first switch on the colur changes in any case once fitted.

I hasten to add this is not a regular operation, but they have been caught out so much lately, with earth problems across a wide range of elements.
it does cure the potential fault.

Another problem is the RCD in most installations now ,I now do not leave the counter without megger testing pat elements although you can get a positive reading and when fitted it still pops. So i dont think there is a real solution other than gen all the time.

maybe we should all demand gen or campaign to get rid of pat elements

would we then all be out of business

who by the way makes these cloned items??

graham

[Martin]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

Another handy tip is to store oven elements in one of those large (B &Q, Staples type Etc) Storage Boxes and lob a few of those silica gel packets in with them! 😉

[petalpop]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

i get only pattern elements from connections and i have never had 1 blow a fuse on cookers or dryers
my elements sit in my van come rain and shine and they are always ok

[4Rickshaw]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

Received from Connect some Ariston oven elements a few weeks ago. Went to do a repair, bloody element ELE4587) down to earth, luckily i had another on the van. These elements have been troublesome for years.

I have cooked elements in the oven and driven the moisture out with a mains supply minus the earth connected, most of the time it does work. It could well be that the elements sweat in the van as the temperature rises from cold to warm as we get on our way in the mornings.

I can only imagine that it is the sealing on the terminals that allows the ingress of moisture for these elements going down to earth, and not the actual production process in the factory. Surely manufacturers should pay more attention to this vital part of the procuction aspect….Rick

[Phidom]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

I’ve sometimes wondered about the thermisters in Hotpoint heaters. I often find when I’m trying to remove the plug from these the whole thing comes out of the heater. When this happens I push it back and tighten the heater nut a bit tighter but I wonder if these thermisters ever pop out?

[Martin]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

Phidom wrote: but I wonder if these thermisters ever pop out?

Put it this way, I’ve never known one to come out once the heater plate is correctly compressed into position (pattern heater or otherwise?) 😕

[robbra]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

Martin,
Did you get any joy on this one?
Rob

[roly16]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

I’ve tried running new oven elements with low insulation resistance on the bench [held in a vice, before anyone asks!] without the earth connected on a number of occasions to cure the problem, but only once or twice have I got it to work. In my experience, when I’ve disconnected the supply and checked them when they’re hot, the IR is nearly always worse than when cold, which is odd as I also always thought it must be moisure in the ceramic insulating material causing the problem. The only explanation I can think of is that the inner conductor isn’t positioned correctly down the centre of the outer sheath and when it heats up and expands, it [almost] comes into contact with the outer sheath.

Qualtex elements always come with silica gel in the bags now. Not sure about Connect’s.

Regarding the relative quality of genuine as against pattern Bosch half-moon elements, I’ve not found the former any better and a Bosch friend has confirmed that in many cases the gen ones don’t last very long . I suspect that a lot of the time gen and pattern elements are exactly the same, from the same factory.

G

[Martin]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

robbra wrote:Martin,
Did you get any joy on this one?
Rob

Not sure of the question now robbra as we’ve covered a number of elements in this thread overall. But in anticipation of your answer I think roly16 has kind of summed the whole thing up in that both pattern and genuine are no better than each other. I’ve had both go belly up on me well within my 12 month parts guarantee period and I for one ain’t best pleased at that situation. 👿

[roly16]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

I think the question robbra was asking Martin was whether he got any compensation from Connect for the pattern Bosch heater that pulled out and flooded the customer’s house, which was the original aspect of this thread.

I’ve just gone back through my records as I remembered fitting a heater to a Bosch washing machine recently, and found I fitted a Qualtex HTR72, the equivalent of the Connect one in question, in May. If anybody has one of these in stock I’d be very grateful if they’d check to see if this one does or doesn’t have the necessary flange on the rubber seal as shown in Martin’s pictures, as if it doesn’t I’m going to have to go back and check it for pull-outability. According to the photo on Qualtex’s website it does, but I’d rather not rely on the photo being of the correct part.

Thanks

Geoff

[Martin]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

roly16 wrote:I think the question robbra was asking Martin was whether he got any compensation from Connect for the pattern Bosch heater that pulled out and flooded the customer’s house, which was the original aspect of this thread..

The experience cost me a total of £215 which I wrote off. I never contacted CDSL of the matter, couldn’t be ar$$.d in fact.:rolls:

Since that time I only fit genuine 265961 Heaters to Bosch machines.

[robbra]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

Thanks Martin,
That’s what I was wondering. Geoff must have read my mind ‘cos I didn’t make it clear.
Don’t think I will be fitting pattern elements to Bosch again.
Rob

[smeghead]

Re: Pattern Heaters: A cautionary tale 🙁

going back to original post-just to let you guys know- bosch element 265961 can be replaced by zanussi 1321020214 , 150 watt lower but hey, it works.(used many times), just change the ntc though!
also the zanussi is 16.96 trade as oppossed to 36.92 trade for the gen bosch (connect prices mind) thats £20.00 difference and youre still using genuine parts.
agree with goatboy, always use genuine.

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