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Manufacturer have just confirmed they have no parts or even a service manual for this old model. Disappointing.
JosephBowen wrote:All good now?
No, not still fixed. Further tests revealed that the clunk at start up is the solenoid valve not the compressor. The PTC (a silver disk) sometimes called a relay, but I’d call a thermistor that powers the start winding from cold only, had part fragmented, making this a strong suspect. It measured 8.4 ohms cold in it’s part broken state, later gave higher values. I can’t get any technical data yet on the PTC. I’ve found PTC disks available from China that fit but with a wide range of cold resistances, but don’t know which is correct? Also rather expensive ($20). In the early stages of fixing I ordered a visually identical plastic unit which also clips on to the compressor pins, and contains a PTC disk and an overload, that was before I realised PTC resistances do vary. Don’t know, when it eventually comes, if it’ll help. Have requested some technical info/service manual from Lec, but don’t know what will come back. In limbo really. Although the fragmented PTC does draw suspicion as I said, I’m uncomfortable that a compressor failing to start (windings intact) for whatever reason, isn’t drawing a heavy standing current and tripping overload periodically.
andyjawa – thanks for the response. When I can get the fridge out for rear access, I will do as you suggest. I measured the cold resistance between Live & Neutral at the plug, after some jumping around it settles at 19ohms. That fits with a clunk at power-on as it tries but fails to start. But thereafter if plugged in it settles to a trivial 0.06amps. Experience of a dehumidifier with a faulty capacitor was a recurring clicking every few seconds, as the stalled compressor drew too much current and the overload protector cut out/in every few seconds. Which I’m not getting here.
So I’m thinking not the capacitor, maybe the relay or PTC. The reason I’m not blaming the thermostat is that there are two of them (fridge+freezer), I changed the fridge one a few years back successfully. My assumption is that both can’t have failed, and if either was calling for cooling, the compressor would run.
When I get it out I’ll check the capacitor and the resistance of the windings. I’m not trying to flog a dead horse here, I know they die eventually. I’m just thinking that it it was a gas loss, it’d just run and run without effect; if it was a seized compressor motor, I’d expect it to be clicking in/out on overload protector. So I’m thinking relay of PTC starter, whatever the latter does. Something electrical so maybe curable. Will report back once it’s out and accessible to the rear.
In case it’s helps answer my question, the total current drawn at the socket in this silent state (door closed so internal light off) is 0.06 Amps.
Any way to confirm? i.e. would I be able to find a winding open circuit? Not sure if I should wait for capacitor, so prolonging the domestic inconvenience, or just write it off now and replace. I realise there’s not many economically practical repairs especially for a DIYer.
OK, will do. I take it I’ll need to fully remove the machine to lift the lid and gain access to see anything? Just because it’ll be the weekend before I can attempt this.
Thanks, yes I thought it was concrete too. Are you saying take off the door seal off from the outside I assume? And if the tub has cracked, wouldn’t it leak continuously throughout every wash cycle, not just the later/spin stages of later washes?
OK, see if this picture link works.
OK, well I’m answering my own post now for anyone else who could find this useful. It was the thermostat at fault, and this is the nearer/front of the two unmarked ones in the roof of the fridge compartment.
Initially I found this forum post partially useful:The combined thermostat/light housing at the top of the LEC T663AW fridge compartment is released with one external screw to the rear, then a second one to the fore at the light/reflector end after removing its translucent cover. The assembly thereafter is stiff to pull down due to the three capillaries attached (one freezer, two fridge) plus wiring working its way from above. A nut secures the spindle of each of two thermostats to a plastic plate.
The front fridge thermostat has two capillaries: a silver metallic one going straight into the rear wall which is easy to remove/reinsert; and a second one coated with white plastic (apart from first few inches) going up into the roof space along with various electrical wires. This white coated capillary later reappears to the lower/left wall of the fridge compartment behind a ventilated plastic cover which can be removed to reveal a short tight coiled end.
Whereas the post above described having to tug fairly hard to extract the second white capillary, no reasonable force would do this for me and the cause later became apparent. The roof of the fridge needs to be removed via a pair of screws to left & right of top rear. The stubborn capillary in fact passes up through a short pipe (along with wires) which is plugged with some foam insulation, then topped above with a golf ball sized chunk of Blu-tack or plasticine type material which must be peeled away. It then crosses to left-hand wall before descending via a conduit again plugged with foam and Blu-tack. The foam plugs are best removed with long-nosed pliers. Once Blue-tack and plugs are removed, it’s easy to extract the descending length of white capillary. If you attach some string to the lower protruding coil end beforehand, you can (like replacing old electrical cable runs) use the string you pull through to later help pull the new one back down again into place.
Replacement is quite straightforward, replacing the foam plugs and reshaping the two Blu-tack mounds back in place. There will be some slack in the white capillary in the roof space which should be snaked around the raised foam hump, in the valley as it were.
Anyone with the same fault (warm fridge despite a working freezer) pondering replacing their thermostat should first check it in situ by removing its wiring connectors and checking its conductivity with a multi-meter. A working thermostat in a (too) warm environment should be calling for cooling with its two contacts closed like a switch. My faulty one, unlike its replacement, was open circuit. The correct thermostat was a Ranco K52 – L2010, LEC part no. 082622036.
Re: Hotpoint WMAL 641 – is the heater working?
iadom – thanks for the further information.
I’ve watched the video on this site, doesn’t look too daunting, just a matter of getting the no doubt heavy machine out of its narrow space under a work surface that someone has snugly got it into. Will try my sack truck initially, unless there are any tricks with tightly fitted machines where you cannot get around one side or the back?
I’m assuming my heater will be round the back via an access panel like the video showed, and not via the front facia as some appear to?
And one other question. The video shows washing-up liquid being used as a lubricant on the rubber gasket (compressed to seal outwards by nut&bolt?). As I’ve got silicone oils/greases, would these be a wiser choice with rubber?
Re: Hotpoint WMAL 641 – is the heater working?
Well a 3hr program did seem to take a fair bit longer, which is interesting given what you say.
I remember living as a student thirty years ago, sharing a washing machine between several of us, we noticed after a couple of years that we’d somehow misunderstood one of the buttons and had been accidentally running only cold washes. None of us had noticed a loss of wash quality.
Is DIY element replacement possible/practical on this model?
Re: Hotpoint WMAL 641 – is the heater working?
Would this particular model have any kind of open-circuit or heat failure sensor? I thought even the older types would wait forever if the target temperature was not attained?
Re: Hotpoint WMF720: F-11 error code.
I’ve found web pictures for both (different company), and it looks like the one I ordered:
http://www.buyspares.co.uk/pressure-switch/product.pl?pid=1951543&query=C00259298
And not like the alternative you list:
Is there anyway your software could be wrong?
Re: Hotpoint WMF720: F-11 error code.
Well, I hope they’ll take it back then. I appreciate electronics may differ, but I thought this was just a switch, and I would have hoped that one version of this switch performed pretty much the same as the next one. I assume the wrong switch is already in transit to me, so I suppose I’d better wait for it’s arrival before I tell them it’s wrong, or they won’t believe me. Pretty damn poor all round, really.
Re: Hotpoint WMF720: F-11 error code.
The site I ordered the part from took the model reference and lead to the C00259298 part number itself, so I’ll be fairly peeved if you’re right. I wrote down the many & various info on my pressure switch, does any of this change your conclusions?
25/02/11 8:15 85-60-330 1600218050
505KA101 11-14 2mA 5VDC 30ES / 11-16 2mA 5VDC 10E3
metaflex hd505 t85u
