UKW Subs Funding – the future?

[Martin]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

kwatt. wrote:If you read back you’ll get the point

Sorry Ken, I have and I don’t. 🙁

kwatt wrote:Also, if it pays for itself you’re kinda off base with the two grand thing are you not?

Same again, off base? 2 grand? No idea what you guys are on about?

Listen, I’m a sole trader true enough (most of us in this trade are don’t forget so I’m in the majority here, no argument there) so what difference does having an ID card in my back pocket mean to anyone? Anyone can pop into a high street photo booth and have his or her picture taken and stick it on a card with company logo at a fraction of the cost.

Please can someone explain to me exactly what purpose all of this serves? I just can’t figure, honest to God. 😕

Is the subs fund burning a hole in someones pocket with nothing to spend it on?….come on….pull the other one. :rolls:

[kwatt]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

Martin wrote:Sorry Ken, I have and I don’t. 🙁

Obviously not. 😕

Martin wrote:Same again, off base? 2 grand? No idea what you guys are on about?

No, you’ve just gone off on one again because you obviously don’t see the point, but, it’s the point from only your perspective, not other people’s. 😉

Martin wrote:Listen, I’m a sole trader true enough (most of us in this trade are don’t forget so I’m in the majority here, no argument there) so what difference does having an ID card in my back pocket mean to anyone? Anyone can pop into a high street photo booth and have his or her picture taken and stick it on a card with company logo at a fraction of the cost.

Oh yes, very professional.

Martin wrote:Please can someone explain to me exactly what purpose all of this serves? I just can’t figure, honest to God. 😕

It’s all about looking professional Martin, whether you are or not is not the point. Just look at many organisations slagged off who have all the cash in the world (in our eyes) and still get it wrong but it’s accepted because they are “professional” in appearance.

This is about that basically. The short of it is, you don’t need it and therefore, apparently by your logic, no-one else does either which to my mind is a bit unfair. You’ve come up with no other reason or logical argument against this whatsoever.

You have your customer base, many of them know you, so you don’t care. That’s the vibe I’m getting and that, if it doesn’t suit Martin then it has to be a bad idea, would that be a fair assessment?

The fact is we do work in schools, hospitals, pubs and building site and we are asked for ID on a fairly regular basis and all we have at the moment is a CORGI card which is hardly applicable when you’re there to fix a washer or install a dishwasher is it? Other people have the same issue and it is a need where you work on commercial premises or public service buildings, especially where you are required to login quite often.

So okay, you don’t see the point but try to think of others and not just your own requirement please.

Martin wrote:Is the subs fund burning a hole in someones pocket with nothing to spend it on?….come on….pull the other one. :rolls:

No, but you obviously have not a clue what it should be used for as you’ve torpedoed every single idea ever mooted IIRC, I can’t recall any that you’ve had much positive to say about.

K.

[kwatt]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

Replying to my own post, I know, bad form but all the same just so you all know the current financial position…

Currently the subs fund consists of as a live balance this evening as copied directly from the online bankiing:

RBS wrote:UK WHITEGDS LTD SUBS ——– 00155227 —– 83-27-31 ——— £9,283.27

We are still due some subscriptions, but not many now.

The subs ain’t exactly what you’d call skint, not rich either mind, but we’ve done not too bad a job of managing and incrementally increasing the funds available over the past while. 😉

Which actually leads me to another point and something I have to ask you all to think about before Sibson.

Can I hive this off to it’s own independent account at some stage please? The primary reason being that I would advise setting up a linked account to a higher interest one so that, the funds that are sat there, accrue a bit more in the way of interest.

The only trouble is that it means we’d have to change the account numbers again. 😕

K.

[clivejameson]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

kwatt wrote:

Can I hive this off to it’s own independent account at some stage please?

The only trouble is that it means we’d have to change the account numbers again. 😕

K.

Fine by me :tup:

[Penguin45]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

If we are going to promote the new WTA, an ID card with Whitegoods Trade Association member emblazoned on it works for me. Public accountability at first glance, discussion opportunity with customer second, professional outlook third.

I would quite happily clip one to my top pocket.

If nothing else at all, it is a visual representation of how far this group has come in 4 years – how we are changing our little world to our advantage at last.

Chris.

[kwatt]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

Penguin45 wrote:If we are going to promote the new WTA, an ID card with Whitegoods Trade Association member emblazoned on it works for me. Public accountability at first glance, discussion opportunity with customer second, professional outlook third.

Thank you Chris for seeing what this is actually about.

There’s more I have to say on this but, IMO, given the sentiment thus far, that we should just get on with it. It’s only one small piece of the tapestry if you like and the rest I think we should discuss at Sibson next month like civilised people… over a light libation. 😉

K.

[aqualectric]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

I am looking forward to meeting Martin at Sibson!! His counter arguments are useful as they give the “why should we?” reaction. And, to a point, he speaks for a fair sector of this trade. “DASA have failed us: so why should any new TA be any different?” could be the conclusion for many.
Now my father always taught me that the only time you can say “Why should I?” is the time you have exhausted all the reasons to say “Why shouldn’t I?”.
I need ID for schools and rest home work; and as I am on the local hospital intranet as a trusted trader I find that an ID card speaks a thousand words, even if it is not studied by the viewer in any great detail.
Most people in the public sector have ID cards and it could be said, well, what’s the point, as everyone in their department knows who they are. BUT- we come in from the outside world and a visible form of ID hung from a pocket or belt chain would go some way towards addressing the curious desk clerk or security guard. 😉
Yes to the ID cards with TA logo and photo. Yes to moving the subs’ loot into a higher interest account.

Steve.

[Martin]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

Penguin45 wrote:If we are going to promote the new WTA, an ID card with Whitegoods Trade Association member emblazoned on it works for me. Public accountability at first glance, discussion opportunity with customer second, professional outlook third.

Steady on Chris! We’re only talking about a little credit card sized piece of plastic here you know? Oh of course it will be very professional, look good but it’s just an ID Card mate. No-ones going to drule over it and ask questions, and don’t clip it onto you top pocket either, civil servants in pin stripped suits do that! 😈

Funny thing is you know but I too attend repairs at schools, college campus’s, commercial company buildings and high security military establishments on a fairly regular basis. All but the military just ask me to sign-in their day book (Name/signature, Vehicle Reg and time checked in) They don’t ever ask for an ID Card and once I’ve filled in their form they give me a lapel badge to wear whilst I’m in the building. Then once I’m done, hand in the badge and write down the time I left.

The military on the other hand are much stricter. In order to prove to them I’m not an Al Qaeda operative, I part my bright red signwritten( 😉 ) van outside the guardroom. The officer asks for my ID (bugger! don’t have an ID Card? darn!) I show him my little pink Driving Licence and fill in their security check-in form by signing my name, vehicle reg and time checked in. Then they give me a lapel badge and a vehicle ‘on-site dashboard notice so I can drive through further check-points on site without being stopped by a hairy giant in fatigues and an AK47 over his shoulder.

All that without an ID Card…………there you go! 8)

Now on the customer in suburbia front, I never, but never get asked to show my ID. After all the ‘net curtain twitchers’ don’t give me a second glance what with my bright signwritten red van and smart blue uniform with my company name amblazonned on my chest. 8)

But I can see the point at which those net curtains would twitch violently if I pulled up in an unmarked van, estate car or even (in some cases) a pushbike! Someone then might (just might) ask for ID? But I very much doubt it!

Don’t put one on a chain neckless by the way, electrically very conductive they are and can get caught round drum pulleys when you least expect it…. 😉

Just looking at it from my perspective that is. 😉 :stir:

[bazza500]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

Well for once I`m on Martins side here. I do work in all the places mentioned including the Royal Marine base and have never been asked for a trade ID card. Personally I can`t see the benefit of one and dare say if I got one it would sit in the glovebox of my van, but there was talk a while back of the local Police doing something like this because of bogus callers.

Like Martin, I have signwritten vans and tee shirts with the company name on them and maybe this is why I`ve never been challenged, but if other engineers are having problems with identification because they are going about in unmarked vehicles then I can see the point.( Although I can`t believe people don`t sign write their vehicles as it`s the best advertising they`ll ever get).

If people want them, and in the end it`s not going to cost anything, then let them have them. I don`t see it doing any harm.

[kwatt]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

We don’t use sign-written vehicles for a number of reasons:

The engineers are both directors and use the vehicle for personal use
They have an estate car or MPV
We work for a plethora of different contracts
I can’t be bothered with it
Working in areas of Glasgow it’s an advert to thieves
It looks kack on a car IMO

So, we do get asked for ID, probably more than those with a van that has signs plastered over it. Not all the time, but we do get asked due to the nature of some of the work. I kid you not, you try to get on a new-build site without ID, CORGI card and a H&S statement these days to do any work for some builders. Nightmare.

Asylum seekers etc. in the flats in Glasgow quite often ask for ID as they are informed to do so by Social Services.

In the end though that’s not the point in some ways, it’s more about marketing. I say that because one of the first thing’s I’d be doing is splattering all over the UKW front page and the WTA one, “How To Identify An Association Member” so that people know that they are in safe hands and that the member works to the COP and is answerable. Easy, you use an ID card. Then you back that up, but I’ll leave the clever stuff for Sibson next month. 😉

So, in essence, it’s about marketing the WTA members as being better than the rest, it’s simple marketing and this is known as “product differentiation”, you have to be different to stand out. This is part of making you guys different to your competition and, in the eyes of potential customers, better than the competition. In effect, you use the WTA as a marketing tool and the WTA can market, as best it can obviously, you and your services as being kosher and excellent.

There’s more to it obviously but, on the whole, for all the cost involved I have to agree with Steve, why shouldn’t we?

K.

[eastlmark]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

kwatt wrote:Replying to my own post, I know, bad form but all the same just so you all know the current financial position…

Currently the subs fund consists of as a live balance this evening as copied directly from the online bankiing:

RBS wrote:
UK WHITEGDS LTD SUBS ——– 00155227 —– 83-27-31 ——— £9,283.27

We are still due some subscriptions, but not many now.

The subs ain’t exactly what you’d call skint, not rich either mind, but we’ve done not too bad a job of managing and incrementally increasing the funds available over the past while. 😉

Which actually leads me to another point and something I have to ask you all to think about before Sibson.

Can I hive this off to it’s own independent account at some stage please? The primary reason being that I would advise setting up a linked account to a higher interest one so that, the funds that are sat there, accrue a bit more in the way of interest.

The only trouble is that it means we’d have to change the account numbers again. 😕

K.

Why can you not do what most of us probably do already…hive off a substatial amount to the high interest account and leave that account open for future subs and then transfer it over?

[kwatt]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

Yes, I could.

However the RBS has a rather nifty way of doing this as I use it for NW, UKW and ISE… what they do is have, in your current account, very little money, only about £500 or something and when payments come in they draw off the high interest account. Thereby maintaining the maximum amount in an interest bearing account as possible.

You can take that one step further and earn more with a limited withdrawal account too.

The problem is that, now, this money shows as part of UKW because of the way some people in Rotherham set it up which is incorrect and, anyway, I’d have to change that account name to the WTA if we all agree to transfer the funds to the TA as its own entity. So, while I do that, I’m as well to set it up this way to save mucking about with it later, again.

K.

[Martin]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

kwatt wrote:So, in essence, it’s about marketing the WTA members as being better than the rest, it’s simple marketing and this is known as “product differentiation”, you have to be different to stand out. This is part of making you guys different to your competition and, in the eyes of potential customers, better than the competition. In effect, you use the WTA as a marketing tool and the WTA can market, as best it can obviously, you and your services as being kosher and excellent.

Blimey all this before the WTA is even up and running eh? Cart before the horse even? 😉

Only kidding Ken please don’t have another fit here…. 😉

Listen fellas…please give this flippin’ ID card business a break for goodness sake….It’s a good idea, its also a DASA idea (which worries me somewhat but there you go- I’ve a lot to argue yet on that by the way :rolls: ) But something that may well fall into place nicely when the soon to be formed committee gets into action on this WTA thing.

£2279 ? from the £9000 in the pot is a big chunk of dosh. And I don’t want you to part with it until the whole flippin show is on the road….OK??

You can have your cards in the fulness of time, if that’s what it takes to make you lot happy? But not now…….keep that money in the pot and stuff it in a high interest account for a while longer.

Have you ever tried putting a cart in front of a horse by the way? No?….Good for you, trust me it don’t work….. :rolls:

And yes Ken marketting the WTA is what it’s all about, better than the rest is the way forward….lets get the infrastructure of that ideal in place first. Then and only then will we have need to hand out badges (ooops sorry?) ID Cards, to those that want one. 😀

[kwatt]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

Some days I wonder why I bother.

Martin, you don’t like the idea, we get it, now shut up for goodness sake, yours isn’t the only voice, but apparently the only one that feels the need to go on and on about how this isn’t what you want and that you don’t think it’s got merit.

Using your own argument, playing Devil’s Advocate, it could be argued that we should be professional from the start and not just when we feel like it. Sometime. Maybe. Whenever.

I’d love to know what infrastructure you’re referring to as well.

And, DASA haven’t issued an ID card in ten years or more I don’t think, I can’t recall ever seeing one! In fact, I think last year was the first in a decade that membership certificates were issued. Normally the only thing I got was a bill and that was usually late.

But what the hell eh, I’ll just shut it and get on with what I’m told to do by Martin. :rolls:

K.

[Martin]

Re: UKW Subs Funding – the future?

kwatt wrote:Some days I wonder why I bother.

‘Cos you care passionately about the trade you are in, just like I do, we both have vested interests in its wellbeing, ain’t that the truth.? 8)

Listen, enough on the ID Card lark, I’m as peed off with it as you are. You’ve caught my drift and that’s that…end of. 😈

kwatt wrote:I’d love to know what infrastructure you’re referring to as well

Infrastructure – what a great word that is and I thought I’d slip that in just for the hell of it! After all said and done, no organisation can exist without it for long. Such an important element, I guess, in the coming weeks. 8)

[Author]

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