[andy2]

Re: WEEE

squadman wrote:To date we have had no offical notification from any goverment or local authority department and when I called the local council some weeks back they did’nt know what I was talking about ????:D

Yep, our local government website has not got a mention of weee at all!!

Don’t despair though, the actual minimum requirements for a retailer are four fairly simple steps.

(1) Takeback – offer takeback (the buyer can return the weee to you free of charge for a set period – not specified – but 28 days recomended).
(2) Return – You have the right to return the weee to a DCF free of charge.
(3) Information – Provide information (as suggested in earlier post) about weee.
(4) Record Keeping – (a) Keep records of information provided (the simplest solution is to keep a signed duplicate of the info that you provide with name, address, date and signature. (b) Keep records of the numbers of weee that you receive from buyers. (c) Keep records of the number of weee that you return to DCF’s. (d) Keep all records for four years from the date the record was made.

If you recondition the appliance and resell then it might be worth keeping records that link the weee taken back to the sale info.

If everything (eg. DCF’s) are in place then its fairly simple. Even if you provide a ‘remove the old machine’ service you simply deliver to the local DCF.

Another thing to note is that you only have to keep records of quantities of weee not detailed records of each machine. The regs to not even specify that you need to get proof of delivery to a DCF.

All this stuff is in section 5 of the directive:-

http://www.berr.gov.uk/files/file35992.pdf

A few more things apply from Section 6 (Miscellanious)

Obligation to optimise reuse and recycling of WEEE
37. Any person who collects or transports WEEE in connection with the carrying out of any obligation under regulation 22 or 23 shall ensure that all such WEEE is collected and transported in a way that optimises reuse and recycling of that equipment or of components of that equipment.

WEEE from private households that presents a health and safety risk
38. Nothing in these Regulations shall prevent any person from refusing to handle WEEE from private households that presents a health and safety risk to any individual because of contamination.

Prohibition on showing the costs of financing the collection, treatment and environmentally sound disposal of WEEE from private households
40.—(1) Subject to paragraph (2), no person shall show a purchaser at the time of sale of new EEE the costs of financing the collection, treatment and environmentally sound disposal of WEEE from private households.

Put in a nutshell:-

(1) Don’t damage the weee in transportation
(2) If its unsafe or contaminated you are not obliged to recieve it.
(3) You cannot reveal any cost involved. (If you do it yourself and don’t join an expensive Takeback scheme then the only cost involved with the minimal requirements is the cost of transporting the weee to the DCF).

Andy 😀

Rabbi joke – very good

[andy2]

Re: WEEE

The requirements for a retailer are a little more involved than this

You must provide the buyer with literature that conforms to the following found in section 5 of the directive. And keep records of such information provided for a minimum of four years:-

Information

33. A distributor who supplies new EEE shall make information available to users of EEE in private households on—

(a) the requirement on each member State under Article 2 of the Directive to minimise the disposal of WEEE as unsorted municipal waste and to achieve a high level of collection of WEEE for treatment, recovery and environmentally sound disposal;
(b) the collection and take back systems available to them;
(c) their role in contributing to the reuse, recycling and other forms of recovery of WEEE under these Regulations;
(d) the potential effects on the environment and human health as a result of the presence of hazardous substances in EEE; and
(e) the meaning of the crossed out wheeled bin symbol shown in Schedule 4.

The following is a suggested format, printed twice on an A4 landscape. The first does not include the ‘confirmation section’ name address etc. The buyer signs the confirmation that they have received the literature and you then tear off and keep this section as your proof. Note that i have taken the actual wording of the directive where possible and added text to make it readable. As far as i can tell it meets the requirements but would welcome any critical comment.

*********************************************************
The Waste Electrical and Electronic Equipment regulations 2006

Under the terms of ‘The Waste Electrical and Electronic Equipment Directive (WEEE) 2006’ each EEU member state is required to minimise the disposal of WEEE as unsorted municipal waste and to achieve a high level of collection for treatment, recovery and environmentally sound disposal.

Due to the large quantities of WEEE that are not at present being reused or recycled it is in all our best interests to ensure that this material is properly disposed of and therefore minimise the potential effects on the environment and human health due to hazardous substances.

Any such materials are now clearly marked with a symbol showing a crossed out wheeled bin (show symbol here) and should not be disposed of as normal household rubbish but made available for recycling or proper disposal.

Take back

As a distributor of new Electrical and Electronic Equipment (EEE)
I am obliged to ensure that WEEE from private households can be returned to me free of charge and on a one-to-one basis provided that any such WEEE:

(a) is of equivalent type to, and
(b) has fulfilled the same function as, the supplied new equipment.

You therefore have the option of returning WEEE that complies with the above stated conditions to the address shown on your Sales Receipt within a period of 28 days from the date of sale of the new EEE.

I confirm that I have been given a copy of this leaflet and understand my right to return my WEEE to the supplier of my new equipment in accordance with the stated conditions.

Name:-
Address:-

Postcode:-

Signature:-
*********************************************************

It is worth noting that you are only obliged to offer takeback ie. You do not have to remove the weee yourself but you do have to receive the weee free of charge if the buyer returns it to you……

Take back
31. A distributor who supplies new EEE to a person shall ensure that WEEE from private households can be returned to him free of charge and on a one-to-one basis by that person, provided that any such WEEE—
(a) is of equivalent type to, and
(b) has fulfilled the same function as,
the supplied equipment.

If you do remove the weee yourself there is nothing as i understand it that prevents you from making a charge for the transportation to your premesis.

The other thing to bear in mind is that any weee that you receive as takeback can not just be dumped at the local scrappy. It must be returned to a Designated Collection facility (DCF) who must receive it from you ‘free of charge’. They have to keep detailed records of weee returned to them and what happens to it. You also have to keep records of weee that you receive and return to the DCF for a min of four years……

Return
32.—(1) A distributor may return WEEE from private households free of charge to the system that has been set up by an operator of a scheme that has been approved under regulation 41 for the purposes of complying with that operator of a scheme’s obligations in relation to WEEE from private households under regulation 22.
(2) For the purposes of paragraph (1), “system” means a system that an operator of a scheme has set up—
(a) in accordance with regulations 24, 25 and 26; and
(b) under regulation 39.

The problem is that lots of areas do not have a DCF at this present time!! So it is probably safer in the short term to get the buyer to sign your paper and then dispose of it themselves at the local civic amenity as this is a legal option for them but not you. Most area’s have a facility where any bulky waste items will be collected by the council for free or a small charge anyway.

Andy 😀

[andy2]

Re: Ignis ADL334 Dishwasher

OK

Don’t actually know what was wrong but i reset it by holding the button and it is now OK. Thanks very much for the help gentlemen – much appreciated.

Andy 😀 😀 😀

[andy2]

Re: WEEE & Recycling

This is typical bureaucratic nonsense gone totally overboard that will actually work against the objectives that supposedly they are trying to achieve.

In my area they started to charge for special collections of unwanted articles washing machines, sofas etc. after about two years they had to drop the charge and make it a free service again because people were just dumping stuff anywhere. It was costing them more to clean the place up than to just collect the stuff. I can see a similar thing happening again because of excessive regulation such as you describe. For instance, you can not transport the motor legally so you leave it with the customer who may just dump it or throw it into her wheelie bin where it will probably end up in a land fill site.

Pen pushing idiots that live on a different planet to the rest of us

Unbelievable!

[andy2]

Re: WEEE & Recycling

Jim, what about scrap yards? These are not going to disappear and usually they will pay for scrap metal.

[andy2]

Re: WEEE & Recycling

I thought it might be helpful to post this info on this thread. It is from the finalised form of the regulations and pretty much cover a retailers obligations.

PART 5

DISTRIBUTOR (includes Retailers) OBLIGATIONS AND RIGHTS: WEEE FROM PRIVATE HOUSEHOLDS

Take back
31. A distributor who supplies new EEE to a person shall ensure that WEEE from private households can be returned to him free of charge and on a one-to-one basis by that person, provided that any such WEEE—
(a) is of equivalent type to, and
(b) has fulfilled the same function as, the supplied equipment.

Return
32.—(1) A distributor may return WEEE from private households free of charge to the system that has been set up by an operator of a scheme that has been approved under regulation 41 for the purposes of complying with that operator of a scheme’s obligations in relation to WEEE from private households under regulation 22.
(2) For the purposes of paragraph (1), “system” means a system that an operator of a scheme has set up—
(a) in accordance with regulations 24, 25 and 26; and
(b) under regulation 39.

Information
33. A distributor who supplies new EEE shall make information available to users of EEE in private households on—
(a) the requirement on each member State under Article 2 of the Directive to minimise the disposal of WEEE as unsorted municipal waste and to achieve a high level of collection of WEEE for treatment, recovery and environmentally sound disposal;
(b) the collection and take back systems available to them;
(c) their role in contributing to the reuse, recycling and other forms of recovery of WEEE under these Regulations;
(d) the potential effects on the environment and human health as a result of the presence of hazardous substances in EEE; and
(e) the meaning of the crossed out wheeled bin symbol shown in Schedule 4.

Record keeping
34.—(1) A distributor to whom the obligation in regulation 31 applies shall maintain records of the number of units of WEEE from private households returned to him under that regulation.
(2) A distributor who returns WEEE from private households under regulation 32 shall maintain records of the number of units of WEEE from private households returned by him under that regulation.
(3) Each distributor to whom the obligation in regulation 33 applies shall maintain records of the information made available under that regulation. 25
(4) The records referred to in this regulation shall be kept for a period of at least four years commencing on the date on which any such record is made and shall be made available to the Secretary of State on demand.
Exemption for members of a distributor take back scheme
35. Where a distributor is a member of a distributor take back scheme, he shall be exempt from complying with the requirements of regulation 31 and 34(1) for the period during which his membership of that scheme subsists.

Part 6 – Miscellaneous

Prohibition on showing the costs of financing the collection, treatment and environmentally sound disposal of WEEE from private households

40.—(1) Subject to paragraph (2), no person shall show a purchaser at the time of sale of new EEE the costs of financing the collection, treatment and environmentally sound disposal of WEEE from private households. 26
(2) A producer may show a purchaser at the time of sale of new EEE the costs of collection, treatment and environmentally sound disposal of WEEE from private households that arises from EEE put on the market before 13th August 2005—
(a) in relation to EEE within category 1 of Schedule 1 until 13th February 2013; and
(b) in relation to EEE within categories 2 to 10 of Schedule 1 until 13th February 2011.
(3) The costs mentioned in paragraph (2) shall not exceed the actual costs incurred.
(4) A person shall be guilty of an offence if he intentionally obstructs any producer from exercising his right under regulation 40(2).

To summerise – a retailer has:-

(1)an obligation to provide information (literature?) to customers explaining the benefits of recycling WEEE etc and their right to have the retailer remove the old equivalent appliance (Take back).
(2) To provide ‘take back’ free of charge and transportation of the WEEE to a recycling operator.

The retailer then has the right to dispose of this appliance free of charge to the authorised operator who then assumes responsability. From this point the recycling is supposedly financed by the producers / manufacturers of the WEEE. The retailer is also obliged to maintain records of all WEEE that he ‘takes back’ and of information (literature?) supplied, for a period of four years.

There are no special licences required for the transportation of WEEE to the recycling facility and a retailer is not obliged to remove WEEE that is considered unsafe (dealt with in other sections).

Although it does not appear to be covered in these regs, presumably a customer has the right to decline ‘take back’, ie. they might want to retain the machine for reasons of their own. In this case it is probably advisable to have a customer sign documentation to this effect.

Hopefully the local authorities will handle most WEEE through the established civic amenity sites (when they eventually agree on the finances) so the only extra burden upon the small retailer will be the transportation of WEEE and the provision of literature (unless you want to join an expensive scheme to have it done for you!)

Anyway, this is my understanding of these regs but please correct me if i am wrong. All in all i think the directive is a necessary evil as it cannot be right to waste resources in the manner that we have in the past, but the consumer will again be the one who foots the bill. Hopefully it might make the manufacturers mend their ways and build machines with a degree of longevity and cost effective repairabilty.

I cannot understand the stance that some manufacturers have taken with the low pricing of appliances and the high pricing of spares which has forced the market into it’s present state. I suspect that the real culprets are the large retail stores who need to sell a steady stream of cheap short lived appliances in order to maintain the high turnover in sales that they require to sustain their large overheads.

From the manufacturers point of view if spares are priced reasonably and appliances are made to be repairable then this will generate a market for them in spares which could be potentially more lucratative than the initial sale. As we all know from days gone by most customers will opt to repair rather than replace if they feel the cost is reasonable, hopefully the costs to the manufacturer of WEEE may help them to re-evalute their position.

Andy 😀

[andy2]

Re: Testing or Bypassing Door Interlock

Don’t get me wrong Greg, I am in no way condoning bypassing an interlock and i agree wholeheartedly with all the posts to that effect.

But everyday in life we take calculated risks of one form or another and if the truth were known i reckon that most appliance technicians / technicianesses have done this at some time as a temporary measure to help out a customer.

But i may be wrong.

Tin hat time, head down.

Andy 😀

[andy2]

Re: Testing or Bypassing Door Interlock

squadman wrote:Never, Never, Ever subscribe to this practice is my strong advise

And excellent advice it is!

BUT its Friday afternoon, can’t get a spare delivered until tuesday at the earliest, it is a customer who you are on first name terms with and have been going to for 20 years. You know they will obey your instructions to the letter. They have a incontinent relative who generates a huge pile of washing everyday…….blah, blah, blah.

Oh that life was always so simple and straightforward!

Andy 😀

[andy2]

Re: Testing or Bypassing Door Interlock

I have on occasions temporarily bypassed interlocks until i obtained a spare. But only if 1) no young children had access. 2) The customer fully understood the danger and seemed mentally competant (few and far between). 3) The machine was unplugged or switched off at the mains before loading/unloading 4) They agreed to a danger notice taped to the front of the machine.

[andy2]

Re: Testing or Bypassing Door Interlock

What if you attend a machine for another fault and discover that the interlock has been bypassed previously by someone else?

Do you:

1) Inform the customer of the hazard and proceed with your repair (its the other guys problem)
2) Refuse to repair the machine (who knows what else is dodgy).
3) Insist that the interlock must be replaced as well.
4) Other

[andy2]

Re: weee directive

Moved to WEEE thread

[andy2]

Re: Dual fuel appliances & Corgi

It occured to me whilst reading the posts on this thread that the really important question is “What is the policy of your public liability insurer with regard to this matter”?

I will have a read through my policy later and see if it is mentioned. If not i will give them a ring and ask. It might not even be an area that has been considered and needs clarifying.

It does seem a shame to pass up easy repair work if it is OK.

Andy 😀

[andy2]

Re: Dual fuel appliances & Corgi

Thanks for that link. I had an idea that i had seen something before on this subject but could’nt find it.

Andy

[andy2]

Re: Is this Legal?

If it not illegal then i would have thought that the onus would be upon the insurance company to prove incompetance. Not all gas fitters necessarily are competant because they have a piece of paper.

For instance a few years ago we had our gas meter changed by British gas. When i returned home from work i could smell gas in the house. You guessed it – a very loose connection on the new meter. Does’nt inspire confidence does it?

Andy 😀

[andy2]

Re: Smeg DWI710E1 4 to 5 hr to complete a wash

No me neither. I tried to explain to the guy that on the old electro-mechanical timers it might have been a timer motor sticking etc. But nowadays with all timing done in software its not really feasable.

I always get the impression though that they think we are looking for excuses to backheel the job because we don’t understand the problem.

Be glad when i retire!

Andy 😀

PS These machines have a 7 min fill timeout, a 3 min drain timeout and a heating timeout so if it was any of these it should give an error.

[Author]

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