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Re: Zanussi ZWF 1431W finally died? ;-(
Hi again Martin,
I had a look closer at that area and I think it’s just carbon / dust etc.
So, I took the motor out and gave it a blow though with the compressor. I then gave it a check with my DMM between all of the motor terminals and ground and it all appeared open cct (not a full test I know).
I popped the motor back in and it’s now working again. 😉
I’ve left it open while I’m testing just so I can check for leaks etc but so far so good. 😉
I checked the brushes while I was there and they stuck out about 12mm?
Cheers, T i m
Re: Zanussi ZWF 1431W finally died? ;-(
Hi Martin,
Hmm, FWIW and from a cursory glance underneath, it all looks pretty clean and dry? Not saying you aren’t right mind. 😉
I have an update though. I disconnected the motor and the machine then fired up ok?
I think I’ll take the motor out and give it a blow though with the compressor and check the brushes etc (unless you are 100{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} convinced it’s a bad board / motor)?
If it’s just the board, are the triacs obtainable / replaceable would you know please?(I’m an electronics sevice eng).
Cheers, T i m
Re: AWD12 bearing job?
Penguin45 wrote:Leave you lot on your own for an hour……. I don’t know. :rolls:
So, I’ve got to grab the next passing sealed tub Zanussi and chop it up, have I? Bound to be one along soon!
Yup, peasy, if I can do it!
The AWD12 (if you feel lucky) – I had the dubious pleasure of getting the dryer going on one this afternoon. A quick look at the construct of the tub itself suggests that the tub front is seriously attached, but the rear is simply a rolled edge, no doubt with a seal or sealant inside. Peeling back the edge might let the back panel come off…….. hint, hint 😀 .
Well, this particular AWD12 is awating a call from someone (anyone) saying they want it for spares, or time for me to break it and stick the bits on eBay. Failing all of that then I noticed the scrap man is back on his rounds again .. (thank you China!). 😉
I do enjoy an adventure.
And me, but I have limits!
Ere, if you searh this site for AWD12 you find thousands of mentions (when I was looking for help for the AEG Lavamat 6100 Digitronic I think I found 1). Does this simply reflect the popularity of the make / model (maybe because it was cheap etc) or that it is as our daughter believes, a nasty POS! 😉
All the best ..
T i m
p.s. The Mrs is much happer with the Zanussi’s controls, certianly over the Aristons “random wheel of confusion” . 😉
kwatt wrote:
T_i_m wrote:
I didn’t realise the ZWF1431W had the water pump off a jet boat .. I guess the ‘Jetsystem’ label on the front should have been a clue!😆
It only relates to the water spray system by way of a recirc pump. 😉
I guessed as much K 😉
Most of the pumps in them, especially the washers, are bog standard Askol affairs although the ratings may vary.
Well this badger must be up the higher end ratings wise .. that or the output pipe being larger in diameter than both the Lavamat and AWD12 offered less resistance?
I actually first heard the water backing up the standpipe (like a large bird whistle) then heard it flowing (quite loudly) over the top of the standpipe.
No harm done as it just gave me an oppertunety to wash the carpet tile that got dirty from the ADW12 bearing. 😉
All the best ..
T i m
Ere,
I was giving that Zanussi a service wash earlier and on pump-out I heard the sound of running water … but like it was running on the floor! 🙁
I quick glance and I saw water pouring over the top of the stand pipe .. 🙁
Shut off machine and found the lower end of the standpipe and all of the trap was down to about 15mm diameter. This didn’t seem to be an issue for the Ariston but the Zanussi has a larger output pipe and therefore overan the abilities of the drain.
I’ve just stripped it all down, unblocked, cleaned, re-assembled and tested and all seems well again (phew). 😉
I didn’t realise the ZWF1431W had the water pump off a jet boat .. I guess the ‘Jetsystem’ label on the front should have been a clue!
All the best ..
T i m
kwatt wrote:I have requested a sample as I’ve not come across it before.
We’ll test it and I may send some (if they send me some) to certain flightless bird to evaluate. 😉
K.
😉
FWIW I tried four ‘sealants’ on the smooth outside (being worst case) of the Zanussi plastic tub, to see what stuck best.
Automotive Tigerseal, Hi Mod Silicone, Unibond Silicone sealant and CT1.
All peeled off fairly easily (and cleanly) after about 12 hours, may have stuck better if left to cure longer and / or the surface had been keyed up a little.
All the best ..
T i m
Re: AWD12 bearing job?
madrat wrote:That sealent is the Dogs dangly bits 😯 how much is it? cant find any mention of price on there web site.
I paid about 8 quid for it and it’s available from ‘your independant builders merchant’ … for me that was City Electrical Factors. Apparently you should also use their solvent for ‘tooling off’ .. being as it sticks to wet fingers ..!
But if you give the distributors a call I’m sure they will tell you:
Email: info@ctechuk.co.uk
Telephone: 01842 828230No connection etc.
All the best ..
T i m
Re: AWD12 bearing job?
So,
Daughter and I have pulled the AWD12 out and put the ZWF1431W in it’s place.
I got her to start opening the Ariston re fitting new bearings and (compared with her recent and only experiences so far with the Zanussi) thinks it’s a POS.) 😉
So, as it was working ok just before the bearings failed (and that’s potentially all it needs atm), would it be the right thing to do, to offer it here, complete or as spare parts .. a bit like Freecycle but with a more whitegoods focus. 😉
Failing that,, do you think anyone would love their AWD12 enough to want to buy bits for it off eBay etc?
All the best ..
T i m
Re: Zanussi ZWF1431W bearing replacement?
kwatt wrote:
T_i_m wrote:
However, I’m not sure we would go to a 10 and don’t some other machines come with 2 year warranties anyway (as per the ISE2)? Ok, the parts might not be as cheap when that expires (unlike the ISE stuff) but some spares seem quite cheap in any case (it’s just the expensive stuff that’s expensive .. like some motors etc)?Yes some others do indeed come with a two year warranty but do the math Tim.
I’m no good at maths .. I like spanners and stuff! 😉
2 years warranty but let’s assume 4 years out a machine at £270…
Over 20 years (the lifespan we reckon is the minimum) from an ISE10 it will cost you 5 machines which is approximately 250kg of scrapped machine, 5 days off or whatever to wait in on the new one and £1350 in raw cost not including the days off, delivery costs, parts cost or anything else.
Ah, see, I don’t do that waiting in thing do I K. I fix things myself as / when they go wrong. This was a point that several of my mates raised when we were all earning little and trying to buy houses etc. They asked me how I could afford to be sorting a house AND racing RC cars, sailing, running various cars etc etc. The answer of course is I never had to pay anyone to do any of it for me! 😉
ISE10 = £800. Done.
Even if it is scrapped after 20 years it’s about 80kg.
Yep, sounds impressive granted (especially from the ecology pov), but not what I would be looking for (as a package, not unless the engineer actually moves in with us that is) 😉
Added to which you get improved performance, quieter (generally), improved wash times and ease of use as well as the other benefits. So, it makes sense economically, use wise and ecologically. Granted it’s not as cheap up front, but good things in life rarely are.
My ZWF 1431W might prove to be 😉
But extend this to the 25-30 year life we really expect from a 10 and you can perhaps understand why I’d say that the 10, whilst perhaps a little more upfront, is by far and away, the cheapest option in reality. The only real thing for people to decide is whether they want to save a few quid now and have a reduced performance or pay more in the longer term and accept the downsides to that.
True. But does anyone *these days* (outside of here of course) want to commit to anything for that long? People rip out / throw away stuff because it’s the wrong colour or not ‘in fashion’ (and ironically the sort of folk who could easily stump up for a 10 but would still throw it away (not even recycle it) in 5 years). It doesn’t have to be broken to be discarded any more so how can you ‘sell’ the idea of vfm or longevity (let alone ecology) to those sorts of folk? 🙁
Don’t get me wrong K, (as you know from my actions) I’m very much with you here.
Do you know what would hold *me* off buying an ISE should I need a new machine … the fact that I would have to have delivered, installed and maintained by someone else! (but I understand why this is the case etc).
Like with the kitcar we built, do you think I would want anyone else repairing a car we built, potentially applying the attention to detail no one doing such things for a living (with all work locked to time limits today etc) could apply as we would?
I’m not saying I’m perfect or that no one could do stuff as well as I could but I actually ‘like’ repairing (and making) my own stuff and prefer to do so in most cases. (the main rason I’m prevented from doing all my own stuff is the law these days. Like, I installed all the gas appliences in this house 30 years ago and have serviced them all along the way. Why would *I* be any less comptitent to do the same today?
So, tell me where I can collect my ISE machine please and then, later, give me access to the spares at the right prices (as I won’t need to call on the warranty anyway will I) and we are all happy! 😉
All the best ..
T i m
Re: Zanussi ZWF1431W bearing replacement?
iadom wrote:
T_i_m wrote:
I have this one but I’m not sure it shows much?
All the best ..
T i m[/img]
That looks quite sound,
Thanks, the CT1 sealant is only a backup for the main physical seal, formed by the round neoprene section. If needed (leaks) I could always add some sealant to the outside of the joint and / or even tape, as has been mentioned previously.
[quote:e7ik1z0t]time will tell I suppose.
Yup, and I’m not actually fully counting my chickens yet! My thoughts are .. unless there is a catostrophic failure (like the two tub sections tearing apart) and with my seals in place, the worst I’m going to get is a damp floor. It can’t flood anywhere that matters as as soon as the water goes anywhere near the main house it will pour through the floorboards. 😉
Really thinking about it, its a pity you didn’t photograph all the various stages,
Yes, I suppose it is, but as I mentioned elsewhere because this was a complete exploration into the unknown and the noises I got back from here were hinting it was probably all likely to end in tears I didn’t bother. Ironically I normally do photo document with such things .. 🙁
I suppose you could always take it apart and rebuild it for us. 😆
Well I suppose I could Jim .. 😉
The point is I actually could .. (I’m not going to btw, before you start ordering the prints ) and apart from the sawing in half illusion bit it really is just a split tub machine now?
All the best ..
T i m
p.s. I’m probably going to close the machine up and put it in place properly today … then to get to work on the AWD12 bearings. If you want pictures say so now! 😉
Re: Zanussi ZWF1431W bearing replacement?
So, the triangular ,concentric ridge would centre the two flanges,thus saving a spigot on one half and a corresponding socket on the other…..
Erm no, I think the triangular ridge was to push against the sealing strip that would normally sit in the groove.
but was the whole of the faces bonded, or was it just the outer”rims” that were fused together.
I think it was all that would ‘bond’ Steve. Because without the seal the ridge was just dangling in the groove I don’t think there was anything for that to fix to.
*thinks , turn about 5MM off the edge, in a big lathe and the tub would fall into 2 halves.* ??
Not quite, cut a very fine slot of varying penetration (the flange ‘cut’ varies from 15 mm to about 30 deep) but at a constant radius from the centre around 90{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} of the tub, then work out what to do around the heater fitting / hump. A way I thought of doing it with more control would be a small thin circular saw (surgical possibly) running on two blocks. You would have to have several lengths of block, some with undercuts to get round all the lugs and bosses.
Now I know better how it was joined in the factory, I reckon I could cut it by hand, leaving the ridge and using a thinner blade create a narrower saw cut so less shortening of the tub length.
Thanks for keeping us up with the saga….(though it’s a shame you didn’t document it.) 🙂
It’s my pleasure Steve, and a big ‘thank you’ to you and all the others here for your advice, warnings and suggestions (and Dave for a good spares service). You never know, I may still have to take it to bits again and I’ll promise I’ll take some pictures if I do! 😉
FWIW I got the tub seal from here: (~£10)
http://www.sealsdirect.co.uk/The sealed bearings from here: (~£18)
http://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/The grease was: Millergrease D180 (used for stern glands on boats) bought from a local car spares place. (given to me)
The ‘sealant’ was CT1 (~£8)
http://www.ctecuk.co.uk/The stainless nut n bolts were from a local machine screw and tools stockist. (~£5)
The main drum seal was from Dave (of this very site / ~£8)
A breakfast for my mate for getting the machine in his van (~£10)
A bottle of wine to the Freecycler who gave it away (~£5).
The satisfaction in doing the project (for all sorts of reasons), priceless (while it lasts anyway)! 😉
All the best and thanks again ..
T i m
Re: Zanussi ZWF1431W bearing replacement?
iadom wrote:manky door seals 😉
As an aside, would it be possible to see some pictures of your handywork?
Close ups of the joint etc.
Jim.
I have this one but I’m not sure it shows much?
All the best ..
T i m[/img]
Re: Zanussi ZWF1431W bearing replacement?
kwatt wrote:
cockney steve wrote:
you’ve nothing to lose trying the bleach/vinegar routineVery true Steve, but a proper cleaning regime would negate the problem in the first place. 😉
Or buy an ISE10 which just doesn’t have the problem. 😉 😆
K.
We were considering an ISE as the next option, should the Zanussi project not work (and it’s still early days) and especially in light of the AWD12 self-destructing in the couple of months we have had it (from about 3 years old).
However, I’m not sure we would go to a 10 and don’t some other machines come with 2 year warranties anyway (as per the ISE2)? Ok, the parts might not be as cheap when that expires (unlike the ISE stuff) but some spares seem quite cheap in any case (it’s just the expensive stuff that’s expensive .. like some motors etc)?
So, does the ISE10 not suffer as per other machines because the door is mounted directly on the tub?
All the best ..
T i m
Re: Zanussi ZWF1431W bearing replacement?
cockney steve wrote:OK, time to COME CLEAN 😳
I’ve got a large commercial bouncy castle…….stored away damp at season’s end……next spring, it’s covered in black mould.
Bought a couple of bottles of white vinegar at the supermarket and went over the whole structure (by hand, inflated) with a face-flannel and the vinegar.(hint: google “cleaning / white vinegar )
followed it with a hot pressure-wash with a strong alkaline TFR (traffic Film Remover ) soap ,followed by a cold rinse……yes you could still see slight staining, but it saved £1800 worth of kit.
But isn’t that PVC Steve? It doesn’t seem to stain as deeply as this washing machine rubber for some reason?
Bleach is cheap, use it full strength (wear rubber gloves…VENTILATION ! ) on the rubber.
Ok, will do. I’ll get some tomorrow.
residual staining is just cosmetic and I would agree with the Professionals’ opinions…..you can control the growths, but not eliminate them.
Ok. Sfunny, I can’t remember the old Lavamat suffering so? Maybe it was how we looked after it .. or possibly the rubber was ‘different’ or better quality (as Iadom suggested)?
💡 start machine cycle….when it’s got enough water in it to foll the sump-hose and pump, pour in a pint or two of vinegar via the soap dispenser.
The hot, vinegary wash should go a long way to cleaning and purifying.
Vinegar contains Ethanoic acid (acetic acid )…germicidal!You don’t have shares in a vinegar factory do you Steve!? 😉
IMHO, “cif” is a waste of time and cash…it’s just a detergent and a fine abrasive…generic “cream cleaner ” is just as effective at a quarter the price, BUT not for this job! the rubber is porous,the abrasive “grinds ” the dirt off the surface of the high-spots, but can’t abrade the pores…so that’s why you need bleach/vinegar.- Anew seal will soon get contaminated,so don’t waste time and cash.
That’s what I wanted to hear. 😉
you’ve nothing to lose trying the bleach/vinegar routine
So where *is* your vinegar factory Steve! ? 😉 I actually soaked the heater element in ordinary vinegar and it worked very well (all be it a bit smelly). The clear stuff isn’t doing such a good job on the lime scale in the soap tray but then I think it’s one of those things that really needs a good quantity of the stuff and some time …
All the best ..
T i m
Re: Zanussi ZWF1431W bearing replacement?
cockney steve wrote:Yes, pic’s would be good, Tim.
Was the bond-line of the two halves just on the edges, or was the whole of the mating face bonded? (IIRC, you said there was a seal in a groove around the mating -face of the flanges.)Ok, imagine the mating faces being a ~15mm flange, as would be a flange between two bolt-together steel pipes (like an old water main etc). On one side of that flange and about 3mm in from the inner edge a deep groove (maybe 5mm wide by 8mm deep) and on the mating surface (on the other tub) a 5mm wide by 5mm high triangle section that would have aligned directly over and into the groove.
When I cut the tub in half I tried to cut as neatly through the actual joint face as I could, so actually cut the triangular ‘lip’ off that tub (it nearly came out as a complete tub sidzed ring ).
To rebuild the assembly I carefully realigned the two halves, clamped them together with several mini Mole grips and drilled through the unused bolt lugs with a close fitting clearance drill for the 5mm x 70mm stainless bolts (I actually wanted 60mm but they only had 70).
I then refitted the bearings, seal and drum, then painstakenly pushed a 12mm diameter neoprene seal into the groove, joining the ends with some superglue (at the top of the tub). I then stacked 3 x 55mm ss washers over each hole (superglued to the tub and each other) then went over the top of the fland + seal and other plain tub half face with a good smear of CT1. I then slid bolts with washers through all holes, fitted washers and nyloc ss nuts and went round first with an electric screwdriver and finished off with a 1/4″ sq drive mini socket set.
The next day I trimmed off the excess with a sharp knife, the rest you know. 😉
Certainly good to see someone else defeating the attempts at forcing you to dump stuff.
Thanks for the support Steve. 😉
It’s something I’ve done since I was about 8. People would give me broken stuff to ‘play with’ (radios, record players, electric drills etc) and I would often get them going then clean them up and give them back (much to their surprise)!At woodwork in school I didn’t want a bathroom cabinet or some book ends so built a 6′ rowing dinghy. The kitcar we built 18 years ago has just gone though another MOT. 😉
My Dell laptop was given to me as ‘broken’ with a failed backlight (a new CCFL from the UK was £65 and £25 from the States, inc delivery!).
I kept the Sierra Estate going for 23 years and the 1/2″ tonne goods trailer I built when I had a MkII Escort (Company Car) is still serving me well.
Yes, we could have bought a new washing machine but then we wouldn’t have any money to spend on more interesting things! 😉
All the best ..
T i m
