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Hi Bistogirl,
There’s a number of things that it could be. It could be as simple a door lock fault or as bad as a recirc pump, without looking at it there’s no way to tell I’m afraid. Best bet is to get someone to look at it from the point you’re at.
K.
Re: DASA
No Chris, there has been some comments levelled at UKW and/or some of the people here. Word filtered back on that marvellous invention, the grapevine. 😉
The thing is, to start slagging off on a personal level, anyone in such a small and enclosed trade such as this is a total folly as it will, inevitably come to light at some point. And yes Alex, from what I’ve heard there were some aspersions cast on someone’s character, but I will not allow this to be lowered to that level and start naming names, I think we’re all above that level.
If anyone has any reason to bump their gums about UKW then come at it head on I say, I and others are more than willing to answer any questions levelled. However, simple derogatory comments like the things I have had fed back will simply be ignored (as they have been in the past as well) as comments from someone not educated enough to construct a reasoned critisism or argument to support their ascertion are not valid in my book. If someone has a point to make, a critisim or anything else I am all too open to hearing it as that’s the only way you sort any issues that arise, just to pass judgement and comment without any reason is just unfounded rantings.
K.
You have to wonder what muppet came up with the idea of foaming in components that were liable to failure don’t you? 😕
K.
Re: DASA
I have no issue at all with the thread recieving the views that it has, in fact I think it’s a good thing and I’m really, really pleased that the Chairman and the council has seen it for what it is, trying to help. It may mean opening a few wounds and making the association look inward but the objective has been achieved well enough. The mere fact that DASA is listening to the comments and at least trying to address them I think shows a lot of spirit.
So if anyone has anything to add, regardless of how trivial you think it is, now’s the time and here’s the platform, have your say. After all, that’s what UK Whitegoods has always tried to give you the chance to do.
K.
Re: Early starts, are you up for it.
As Richard points out I’m more of a “wee small hours” kinda vampire. 😉
That said I’d certainly put it to the guys if there was some renumeration there for it. Whether they’d want to go down that route is their call really and I have to bear in mind the other work that we do for the likes of builders and retailers, but in principal I see no reason why it can’t be looked at.
K.
Well information has started to filter out about the NESN meeting held today and, since it’s now public knowledge of sorts…
Apparently, the rumour 😉 goes, that Merloni UK signed up this deal with NESN and were all good to go without any technical backup or spares accounts in place and, get this, despite the NESN spin on it, they were never on the table from the get-go! So it all goes ahead, NESN get a gold star for bringing some work to the network and Merloni gets bailed out over the busiest time of the year. From what I can gather the work was never to placed with NESN on any permanent basis and would have been reigned back, probably during 2005.
However, there was a fly in that ointment…
The Italians found out what Merloni UK were all about and put an instant stop to it, hence the whole thing was stopped overnight with virtually no explanation. If you’ve ever worked for an Italian company you’d understand that and fully expect it as well as, whilst the Italians are sharp businessmen to a fault they also do tend to be pretty loyal to thier workforce.
Anyways, the chances of NESN making any headway there at all is practically nil from what I can gather, so don’t rest any hopes on that work coming that route anytime soon.
More rumours and speculation as we get it.
K.
Re: An optimistic view!
What the WEEE Directive will do is impact upon retail pricing, to what extent remains to be seen and also what cunning plans are laid to combat that cost. I should think that almost every manufacturer is now looking towards some form of disposal that is cost effective.
I seem to remember that local councils also have an obligation to remove a certain amount of waste product from a property, but there are limits in a calendar year, bear that in mind as that may be an escape in some regards. However the legislation will not be finalised until January 2005 and I’m hoping to have someone at the UKW meeting in February to talk us through the implications of it for us as repairers and retailers.
And I gave up on the quote as Martin Luthor King used that phrase in his famous “I have a dream” address in Memphis, 1968. I knew I’d seen it before as well, on a wall outside the hotel where he was shot and not in a stage production. 😉
K.
Just the design philosophy at work.
Cheap to build on an assembly line does not mean easy to disassemble in the field. Sadly very few manufacturers take account of the fact that we often have to service and appliance in a kitchen that has an area of free space area akin to a postage stamp. 🙁
K.
Re: DASA
Del wrote:Perhaps DASA can be likened to bearing change on a washer. you sometimes have to take things apart before you can fix them.
Very true, let’ hope it’ not BER. 😉
Del wrote:And just to show theres no hard feelings. The lads at Dasa have insisted that at our AGM next weekend in York we have taken the liberty of booking you a seat at a resturant 😯 ….. in MANCHESTER! 😉 LOL
:rotfl:
Del wrote:P.S. I suppose you’ll be hamerin’ the JD ‘N’ COKE again !
Moi? 😈
K.
Re: DASA
I have to admit I was really swutherring about posting a reply to this thread at this stage but, well I couldn’t resist it really. 😉
First off, I’m glad that many council members have taken this thread in the context that it was intended, i.e. not a “let’s kill DASA” thread, but more a, “let’s put DASA under a microscope and see what shakes out” thread. I’m really glad of that and that it has been recieved in the obvious intended spirit.
I do think that DASA needs a leader, but it also needs direction right now and that means a commitment to the cause and I’m not talking about a few meetings a year, they are pretty much irrelevant IMO, this is going to need full on, full time TLC and a lot of changes instigated.
And Jason, we’ve all been guilty of that. 😉
K.
Take off the “198” and you have the MFI part number, listed @ £3.75 ex VAT. Dave can probably get one in a few days is MFI have stock.
K.
Re: gloves off week
Well this is getting interesting now and we’re getting a brilliant debate on DASA not that you guys with “DASA” stamped on your foreheads will like it too much, so sue me! 😆
This HAS to be done! We either sort DASA and get it back to where it should be and what it should be doing or we bin the thing and start again fresh. It is stale, I don’t think anyone could argue that point and it needs a shot of life injected into it.
From that debate, which no doubt some people will be reeling from, there has been some excellent points made and some fantastic ideas as well to go forward, there is very rarely a debate such as this that does not produce a positive result even when it seems damaging. But this sort of empassioned debate on what DASA is and where it’s going is what we should have been having at council instead of fucking about with training and all that other crap. We got rid of Chris, we can now change it and mould it into something worth the while but it will take more than attending the odd meeting to do that.
The question is, does the council and in particular the officers have the stomach and the time to get it back on the map?
K.
Re: DASA
Del wrote:If there were better communication between all of the above, It would come as no surprise to anyone that we have more in common than that which divides us. It is only when one of the above tries to monopolise and play one off against another section or firm, that we all be come loser’s.
Agreed. Communication is not a strong point of DASA though and it desperately needs improving.
Del wrote:Europe and politicians have been throwing laws and dictates at us left right and center over recent years. Remember the fridge mountain and now the directive on electrical and electronic waste. These issues impact on the whole trade.
And where has DASA been in all this? What communication of any of these issues that affect our trade has been forthcoming from DASA?
The thing is Del that when Orbit was scrapped any communication that DASA once had with the membership was simply gone. Therefore, IMO, DASA lost it’s only method of communication with the membership at that point and the means to relay any pertinent information. To my knowledge it was viewed as being too expensive to produce, now look at the cost of not producing the publication.
Del wrote:We now see the internet starting to taking off, robbing a lot of the retailers of their traditional trade. I’m not against fair competition, but when you have some firms that consist of a couple of geek’s hiding away in an attic who never get to even see the product they are selling or care even less when the end customer has a problem, simply because they are playing a numbers game. do you regard this as fair competition, I dont.
Manufacturers and distributors are tackling this issue currently on their own with a few things in place in an attempt to halt this current phenomena.
Del wrote:Some of our Insurance companies need to be told that charity begins at home. They like to be seen to be sponsoring the Art’s and Sport with mega donations, How about helping to sponsor trianing in a trade that provides you with the bulk of your earnings. In all fairness one has recentley offered me in a go in a go-kart but I would much rather they offer me some help towards training the next generation of engineers if we are both to stay in business.
There is another side to that in that it couls be seen as giving something back to the principals for their efforts and it is rare that any such events are not clouded in talk of business. I regard them as a meeting that has a bit more interest attached, I do however take the point.
Del wrote:The skill’s shortage is already here. Kevin’s crystal ball is well tuned in, so are we now going to perpetuate the vicious circle, as we are starting to get the upper hand. Because we have been sqeezed so tight on price that we have lost a great deal of our numbers. We have recently seen manufacturers who cant get help or engineers for love nor money.
Ah, the nitty gritty. 🙂
Here’s the deal in my view. Over the past decade or so the trade has been erroded away and the trend continues, it continues because what we have been paid has been erroded over that time against a tide of rising costs and the lowering of value in the appliances that we repair. Customers no longer see, for example, a washer as having a ten year lifespan and they will scrap it at two years if the economics dictate that they should do so. In addition to that the premiums paid to us by many an insurer now, which was once regarded as “premium rate” work has been desperately erroded to the point where some insurers now pay less for a call than some manufacturers under warranty and with no mark up on spares that once were re-sold at retail pricing to them. This is a ludicrous situation to be in and in light of that it’s no wonder we’re not training anyone as, quite simply, we cannot afford to do so!
Whilst the above is very clever and no doubt saves the insurance industry a fair bit of money it has exasberhated an already tenous situation with regards to training. And, with the lack of chargeable work out there and, what is there holds little value, there is no fat left to trim in the service industry.
In addition to that we are only now starting to see some manufacturers and, most certainly not all, get realistic about the renumeration to agents especially in light of the above. It used to be a that a certain amount of chargeable work was almost guaranteed through holding an agency for any manufacturer, that is no longer the case and any figures I’ve seen, projection wise, for in particular the larger manufacturers on chargeable call levels are frankly laughable and totally unrealistic.
In light of all that you have an organisation with DASA that seeks to promote training, to who exactly? Who can afford to carry a trainee these days? DASA has not changed its ethos in years and is still tackling problems that existed 15 years or more ago, many of which are irrelevant in today’s market under the current conditions IMO.
Del wrote:It’s not just DASA that needs to get it’s act together it’s all of them including, RETRA,AMDEA,CORGI, and whatever association that governs insurance companies.
Yes and just what do those organisations care of service?
Answer, they don’t unless it becomes a problem.
So, there is but one course of action really, make it their problem and shout long and hard about it. DASA has not ever, to my knowledge done so. Again, to my knowledge, the plight of the service industry has never been represented to ANY of these organisations and in fact just recently I was told that AMDEA was oblivious to the industry standard of a three month termination in most of our contracts. Obviously DASA has not done its job there until very recently.
Del wrote:Cheap machines and rediculously priced spares have been the cause of a lot of our problems. but as we start to find out that we are running out of landfill space and once the cost of recycling is built in then these lumps of scrap wont be so cheap. Is’nt it time we got back to building machines that we could all take some pride in. pride in building , pride in selling and pride in servicing.
Yes this is going to become a huge issue in the very near future and the first I heard about the WEEE Directive was on UKW, I’m sure many others are in the same boat, but DASA should have been telling us about that a lot sooner.
Del wrote:Is it not time for a little sanity in this trade, a little respect for one another, is there need for us all to communicate, your dam right there is.
Yep!
Del wrote:None of us on our own, can effect any change but by working together through an organisation of mutual support we might be able to make a start.
Indeed, I do not disagree with that at all.
Del wrote:Ken ask’s “What does DASA stand for ? What are it’s aim’s ? Where is it going?
I have tried to explain some of the things that I stand for and I know that there are people on the DASA council who stand for the same.
And I have pointed out that whilst that may well be the aims and the members that take part passionate about the issues, very little if anything, has been done to address them. I’m not laying the blame at anyone’s door really so don’t get me wrong, but that old “apathy” crept in and often a lot of the ideas from DASA lose momentum due to that.
Del wrote:DASA aim’s :-
The Association aims to promote good service, efficiency and courtesy to all members of the public. The members of DASA have a Code of Practice that is designed to protect the customer from bad trade practices. The DASA Code of Practice is registered with the Office of Fair Trading. DASA has Criteria for Service Quality, Guarantees, the Environment, Insurances, Competence and Safety Testing.
Which was clearly marked “Sell-By 01/01/1986” 😉
The industry has changed massively in the past decade or so, DASA has not and it needs to change to remain relevant.
Del wrote:Where is DASA going ? Well, to be perfectly honest, without the support of like minded people within this industry…… NOWHERE!
Indeed, this is very true and without support DASA will wither and die but again, it all comes back to the questions I asked previously which, despite protracted debate, still have not been answered.
K.
