Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Re: AGM
Hi all,
Looks like it’ll be the Friday evening then…..
One thing on the agenda for me will be the COP. I’d appreciate it if we could go through the responce from the OFT step by step and talk about the points raised and then agree on what we do to ‘satisfy’ their issues.
Adrian 🙂
Re: AGM
HELLOOOO!….
Can we get some input from everyone? UKW meeting is just a few weeks away and I for one would like to know when I need to commit myself….
Personally I think we should get together before everyone arrives so we can all be up to speed should any of us be asked any questions about on-going issues etc without having to say ”I dont know, ask ….”
Just my opinion! Ade 😀
Re: Payment Issues & Other Problems
Alex wrote:Must admit, easier to state who does support you & pay with no trouble rather than the opposite.
Too true!
CDSL Excellent, ISDAL Excellent, D&G Excellent (1 payment issue recently, but sorted very quickly by Service Support staff)……
Adrian 🙂
Re: Payment Issues & Other Problems
SERVICE FORCE!
Upon giving approprite notice to terminate a Service Agreement, They withdraw spares account terms and withhold payments untill both accounts have been finalised!…….
WITHOUT ANY NOTICE……. YOU ONLY FIND THIS OUT WHEN NO PAYMENT HITS THE BANK AT THE END OF THE MONTH!
That’s my experience anyway! 8)
Re: AGM
I won’t be able to do sat morning, i’ll have to up and go….. it’s my day with my boy on a saturday 😀
Re: Discounted Fuel For The WTA
kwatt wrote:do we open this up to the general trade as a gift from the TA.
Hmm.. My view is no, only because the fuel card scheme was set up for WTA members… So it should remain, for WTA members. People pay to be a member, so they should get more than the the ‘non paying’ general population… But that’s just my view 😀
Re: COP Draft
OK, a bit more work to do then, but this is the reply I’ve had… Deep breath!….
INFORMAL ASSESSMENT OF THE WHITEGOODS TRADE ASSOCIATION CONSUMER CODE UNDER THE OFFICE OF FAIR TRADING’S CONSUMER CODE’S APPROVAL SCHEME
1. Organisation
1a Code sponsors should have a significant influence on the sector.
Information not provided
The information we require here is:
• How many members you have
• How much of the sector your organisation/code covers
• Details of any involvement you have in industry/treading initiatives
• Details of how you have previously raised standards in your sector
• Where appropriate, details of any previous involvement your organisation has in raising standards in a sector which has a significant ethnic minority presence.1b Compliance with the code shall be mandatory on code members.
Criterion not yet met
In the code under Responsibilities of the WTA, it states that:
This section of the Code describes the responsibilities the WTA has to ensure that WTA members follow the provisions of this Code and……..
We would advice that this statement be made clearer and strengthened. An example of the wordings for the statement is:
The code of practice is mandatory to members and they must comply with its requirements at all times.
Can you please confirm whether members sign a statement reaffirming their compliance with the code when renewing their membership annually? If there is a statement, can you please provide me with a copy?
1c Code sponsors shall have adequate resources and funding to ensure the objectives of the code are not compromised.
Information not provided
This criterion is aimed at ensuring Code Sponsors have adequate funding and staff to fulfil their obligations. What constitutes adequate recourses and funding depends on the size of the code sponsor, what the code requires them to do and the demand of the sector.
Evidence you could provide are:
• Details of staff numbers assigned to the administration of the code and a written statement that these are appropriate for the number of members you have
• Details of funds available to your organisation and a written statement that these funds are sufficient to cover the cost to operate your code of practice and undertake the monitoring requirements under the CCAS.
2. Preparation2a Code Sponsors shall be able to demonstrate that organizations representing consumers, enforcement bodies and advisory services have been adequately consulted throughout the preparation of the code.
Criterion not yet met
This criterion is aimed at ensuring that the code of practice is relevant to real consumer needs. To achieve that, code sponsors will need to involve organisations that represent consumers, enforcement bodies and advisory services throughout the preparation of the code.
To meet this criterion, the OFT will undertake and fully co-ordinate the consultation process at this stage. Before WTA completes Stage One of the CCAS application process, you will need to provide evidence that you have acted on proposals or suggestions received from the advisory bodies.
2b Code Sponsors shall be able to demonstrate that organizations representing consumers, enforcement bodies and advisory services are being adequately consulted throughout the operation and monitoring of the code
Criterion not yet met
This criterion is aimed at ensuring that the code of practice stays relevant to real consumers needs. Code sponsors will involve advisory bodies throughout the preparation of the code and in the operation and monitoring of the code.
Evidence for criterion 2b is relevant for stage 2 approval only.
3. content
3a The code shall include measures directed at the removal or easing of consumer concerns and undesirable trade practices arising within the particular sector.
Information not provided
The aim of this criterion is to end undesirable trade practices in your sector and to ease consumer concerns about undesirable practices.
Code sponsors should be aware of particular issues in their sector that need to be addressed. Involving advisory bodies is a key factor in making sure these issues are addressed by the code. If they are not currently addressed by the code, we will need an explanation of why this is so.
Information we require to meet this criteria will include:
• Relevant requirement in your code that addresses specific consumer concerns or undesirable trade practices
• Information on how your organisation makes itself aware of consumer concerns and undesirable practices.
• Details of how you react to concerns that have been raised and the measures you have taken to ease them.However, this criterion cannot be met till consultation done with consumer advisory bodies has been cleared.
3b The code shall require that code members ensure that their relevant staff know about and meet the terms of the code as well as their legal responsibilities. Appropriate training is to be provided.
Criterion met
The Code of Practice states that members must ensure that their staff know about and meet the terms of the Code as well as their legal responsibilities.
Aims of the Whitegoods Trade Association Code of Practice in the Code of Practice states:
“WTA member is required to fulfil all relevant statutory and legal requirements, in particular those relating to Trading Standards, Health and Safety, Environmental Protection and Employment.
All WTA members and staff will receive training which enables the provisions of this Code to be put into practice, thus ensuring that the best possible service to the consumer is provided.
3c The code shall address clear and truthful marketing and advertising as appropriate to the sectorCriterion not yet met
Provisions to ensure that members are fully aware that all marketing and advertising must be clear and truthful in order to protect consumers from misleading advertising has been raised under Advertising & Promotion, which states:
WTA members will:
‘Be legal, decent, honest and truthful and will comply with the British Codes of Advertising and Sales Promotion and any other relevant code of advertising and all other statutory requirements’.
We would recommend that reference be made to the relevant statutory requirements of advertising to include the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008
3d The code shall address clear and accessible pre-contractual information as appropriate to the sectorCriterion not yet met
Most of the Pre-contractual information we would like consumers to have before deciding on entering into a contract with your members have been covered.
We would advice you place all that information under an obvious heading such as Pre-contractual Information, strategically placed before the paragraph on contract terms. A list of all the information we would like covered are listed in the core criteria and guidance, which I have sent with this document.
3e The code shall address high-pressure selling as appropriate to the sector.
Criterion met
WTA has outlined measures for members to take to remove the possibility of consumers being subjected to high pressure selling under customer care. It states:
‘Not use any high pressure selling techniques to carry out work, but will inform the customer of any action that in their opinion is to be recommended on the grounds of safety, reliability or simply good customer care.’
3f The code shall address clear terms and conditions of supply and fair contracts as appropriate to the sector.
Criterion met
This has been addressed appropriately under Contract Terms in the Code.
3g The code shall address delivery and completion dates as appropriate to the sector.Criterion not met
Delivery and completion dates have not been addressed in the code. Please read the guidance given for this criterion.
3h The code shall address cancellation rights as appropriate to the sector.Criterion met
Cancellation rights have been addressed under Cancellation Rights in the code.
3i The code shall address guarantees and warranties as appropriate to the sector.Criterion not met
Guarantees and warranties as appropriate to the sector have not been addressed.
Consumers need to understand all the guarantees and warranties that apply to their transactions, therefore members must provide accurate details of:
• Standard guarantees and warranties that are included in any transaction
• Which guarantees and warrantees are optional
• The cost of additional guarantees/warranties
• Who the additional guarantees/warranties are offered by
3j The code shall address protection of deposits or prepayments as appropriate to the sector.Criterion not yet met – Not enough information provided
Can you please give details of how deposits or prepayments are protected by WTA in the unlikely event that a WTA member ceases to trade?
3k The code shall address customer service provisions as appropriate to the sector.Criterion met
We agree that the WTA code promotes effective and appropriate customer service and members are expected to provide consumers with effective and appropriate customer service. This is covered under Customer Care.
3l The code shall address the additional effort/help to be provided to vulnerable consumers as appropriate to the sector.Criterion met
This is addressed under Customer Care
4. Complaints4a The code shall include a requirement that code members shall have in place speedy, responsive, accessible and user friendly procedures for dealing with consumer complaints. A specific reasonable time limit for responding to complaints shall be prescribed.
Criterion not yet met
WTA has established an efficient friendly process for dealing with consumer complaints; however we would advise that WTA does not restrict consumers from going straight to the independent arbitrators without using the WTA conciliation service.
4b The code shall include a requirement that code members shall offer the same level of co-operation with local consumer advisers or any other intermediary acting on behalf of a consumer when making a complaint as they would to the complainant.Criterion met
The Code of Practice states:
“Should the customer prefer to pursue a complaint through another person or a recognised consumer organisation like Trading Standards, Citizens Advice etc, then the WTA member will continue to cooperate fully to resolve the complaint.”
4c The code shall include procedures for dealing with complaints including the availability of conciliation services directed at arranging a decision acceptable to both parties.Criterion met
The WTA provides an effective conciliation service for its members and their clients.
4d The code shall include the availability of a low-cost, speedy, responsive, accessible and user-friendly independent redress scheme to act as an alternative to seeking court action in the first instance.
The scheme shall be binding in respect of code members who shall not be able to refuse to allow a complaint to go before the scheme if a customer chooses.The code member shall be bound to accept a decision made under the scheme. Any such scheme shall be able to take into account possible breaches of the code where relevant to the complaint.
Criterion not yet met
WTA provides an Independent Arbitration service for its members and their customers. However, we would like the restriction lifted as mentioned in 4a.
5. Monitoring
5a The code sponsor shall develop performance indicators, e.g. mystery shopping exercises and independent compliance audits, to measure the effectiveness of the code.
Criterion may be met
WTA monitors the activities of its members by:
• Audit the Best Working Practices, Technical and Customer provisions of each WTA member annually.
• Review and assess customer complaints and customer satisfaction feedback data to determine any need to revise this Code or take action against a WTA member. Our scheme allows for a variety of measures to occur, these range from actions to improve WTA members performance through to expulsion of a WTA member from the WTA network.
WTA’s monitoring methods will be forwarded to our statistician for his consideration.5b The code sponsor shall implement and the performance indicators and make available the results of the performance indicators to demonstrate the effectiveness of the code.
Criterion not met – Information not available
5c The code sponsor shall publish a written report annually to the OFT on the operation of the code to include:
• Changes to the code agreed with the OFT and implemented
• numbers and type of complaints including information on outcomes from the conciliation process and to the independent redress scheme
• results from monitoring, satisfaction surveys and the disciplinary process.It would be preferable if the report were compiled by an independent person or body with powers to recommend actions.
Criterion not met – Information not provided
5d The code sponsor shall provide copies of the annual reports to the OFT.
Criterion not met – Information not provided
5e The code sponsor shall regularly review the code and update its provisions in the light of changing circumstances and expectations.
Criteria not yet met
The code states that the code will be further developed to ensure it remains of benefit to the consumer.
WTA would need to state how often you will review the code and inform us on the procedures you have in place to review your code of practice
5f Consumer satisfaction shall be regularly assessed.Criterion may be met
Consumers Satisfaction shall be regularly assessed, refer to 5a. The monthly monitoring of the Code includes consumer satisfaction
The OFT would need to see and approve a copy of the questionnaire.
6. Enforcement6a The code sponsor shall establish a procedure for handling non-compliance by members with the code. The procedure shall include reasonable time limits.
Criterion not yet met
Non-compliance is addressed in the code, however the OFT would like to know what the time scales are. We would also want more information on who independently verifies the process.
6b The code sponsor shall also set out a range of sanctions, e.g. warning letters, fines, termination of membership, for dealing with non-compliance.Criterion not met
Please provide details of the range of sanctions that would be used against members who breach the code.
7. Publicity
7a Code sponsors and members shall ensure that their customers are aware of the code.
Criterion not met – Information not provided
We would advice the WTA code of practice states that members should ensure their customers are aware of the code and methods by which they can do so, for example:
“You must display copies of the code in all your offices. You must also have available, free of charge, copies of the Code of Practice to give consumers on request – and a notice to this effect must be displayed.
7b Code members are to make clear, e.g. in advertising, point of sale, their adherence to a code of practice.
Criterion not met
7c Copies of codes shall be available without charge to customers, to members, to local consumer advisors and to others with a legitimate interest.Criterion not met
Please see 7a.
7d Copies of any code related publicity generated by the code sponsor shall be provided to the OFT.Criteria not met – Information not provided
WTA has to give the OFT a statement that they are willing to clear code-related publicity information with the OFT before such information is published.
7e Code sponsors and members shall publicise the fact that the OFT has approved the code by using the CCAS logo in the prescribed manner.Criterion not met – Information not provided
WTA has to give the OFT a statement that it is willing to publicise the OFT’s approval of their Code of Practice by using the CCAS logo in accordance with the terms of the copyright licence.
7f Code Sponsors shall comply with the terms of the standard copyright licence, disseminate the terms to their members and monitor their members’ use of the CCAS logo. Appropriate action shall be taken by the Code Sponsor against a member for non-compliance with the copyright licence.
Criterion not met – Information not provided
WTA will need to confirm that they are willing to sign the copyright licence and disseminate the terms on use of the CCAS logo to our members, to monitor usage, and take necessary action against a member for non-compliance with the usage terms.
Adrian 😯 😀Re: They’re checking!
It may have been co-incedence that I had that phone call after this ‘suspicious job’. If we were being ‘checked out’, surely they’d have to reveal themselves afterwards? Who would it be? Local trading standards? For what reason? If they suspect something bad for some reason and set up things like that, do they just blow the trumpet if a Business is caught doing something wrong?
Or can anyone just do that to different types of Businesses? 😕Re: How to beat the recession
simonb wrote:Whats the fair and honest way of dealing with the situation of turning up to a later machine that you start to scratch your head at whilst looking at 😕 do you charge callout charge or labour fee?
Not at all! Better off walking away and not charging a penny than guessing and possibly getting it wrong and costing you money, embarrassment and headaches!
boselecta wrote:normally if you offer a free call out you will have a larger work load.
I couldn’t agree with you more! But that comes with more fuel spent on travelling round the extra customers, more time out on the road, more time in peoples houses who only have you there because your FREE!…. less ‘quality’ customers, more messers, the list can go on!
I’d rather 5 paying customers per day regardless of BER or whatever than 10/12 with freebies in that lot!
Back to the recession bit of this thread…. How to beat it…. Surely thats got to start with cut costs and increase income / maximise profit from the income…….? Charging callout fees/estimate fees etc will do that!
But, before I get shot down….. That’s only my personal opinion 🙂
Re: How to beat the recession
simonb wrote:i find say out of 10 jobs for example 2 might be ber on average so just back in van and onto next job(after trying to sell them a new appliance of course)
Hi simon,
So, just to clarify, you drive a few miles (using fuel that you’ve paid for), you spend 10-30 mins in someones house diagnosing a fault that ends up being BER, then you simply go “back in van and onto next job” 😯
At the end of the day, fuel is not free, tyres are not free…. time, is not free! Somewhere along the line, that has to be paid for…. By someone 😕
Wouldn’t get a gasman out spending half an hour looking at your boiler for free…. That’s for sure! You’d either get a replacement from him or a bill! What’s the difference with us? We’re skilled too! (That’s something I don’t get)!
But back to your question….. “so how do enginners who charge callout earn more money then?”
Simple! 2 engineers, same rates, go to the same number of jobs, with the same BER rate (2/10)…. The one that charges an estimate fee / callout charge whatever will get paid for the 2 BER’s…… That’s how 😉
Adrian 🙂
Re: COP Draft
Reply from OFT:
Thank you for sending me your draft code of practice for an informal assessment against the core criteria of the Consumer Codes Approval Scheme.
This week, after tomorrow, I will be out of the office on business and will not have an opportunity to carry out my assessment until next week. I hope to send you my comments by 25 July.
Adrian 🙂
Re: Invoice wallets
Also, I know they’re not that cheap, maybe £1-1.50 each, so if that were taken into account on every repair, in theory, the engineer would not even end up paying for them! 😀
Re: COP Draft
It’s gone! Hopefully all will be OK with it and then the ‘wheels’ are definately moving! 😀
