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Re: Loop / Socket Testing.
I carry around £2,000 worth of electrical testing equipment and due to the nature of my work use it on every call.
Please read and digest the whole of my comments as one, cherry picking is best left to overzealous news reports.
If you do a repair & check the Earth on the appliance, what happens if your customer then gets a shock & takes you to court ? you tell the court that you tested the Earth on the appliance and that was good but as far as your concerned that’s where your responsibility ends, not going to look too good is it ? The other thing is what happens with your PL insurance ? are they going to pay customer compensation after that comes out ? doubt it because they’ll be loking for any way possible to get out of paying.
You have kinda answered that question yourself, your responsibility as an appliance engineer is to the appliance. There is no legal requirement to carry out any safety test in a domestic home on the installation or the appliance.
Beko currently have in excess of 100,000 products requiring a safety recall due to known defects. Anybody in prison yet ?
Lets be honest it takes seconds & costs nothing to do, if it saves just 1 person from getting a shock then as far as i’m concerned it’s worth the effort
Absolutely, but until everybody is on the same page, regulated, enforced, its achieving nothing.
Although there is a cost, to you for equipment, yearly calibration and training. When balanced against the regulatory need (Lack of), the reduction in death/injury you’ve achieved and the chances the client will ignore your advice, its probably the reason why politicians are not interested, even when Beko are destroying peoples homes the govt does not seem bothered.
Re: PAT Testing
Martin wrote:
DrDill wrote:
Martin you say PAT is pointless?No, not that PAT is pointless Doc but rather when I looked into the idea of doing PAT testing years ago and finding it not to be a legal requirement, the whole process of my bothering is rather pointless. I then elaborated further my reasoning in my earlier post. On the contrary to your interpretation I fully appreciate the significance and importance of the PAT test but not sufficiently viable for me to even consider expanding my business services.
If it costs upwards of £500 to even set up shop doing PAT these days I would certainly give it short shrift. But each to their own I suppose and if you can enhance your business by performing this service then I wish well of those who do. 😀
So you advocate loop testing the whole house, which is not a legal requirement but you wouldn’t PAT test all the appliances in the house.
Shame on you.
I guess there are limits then, to clients safety. 😉
Re: British Gas go Hi Viz
I’d love it.
Had a guy with a range cooker, gave me a list of required parts he’d diagnosed, got stroppy when I asked him what the issue with the appliance was, he just needed those parts.
He was in my way the whole time I was working on it and kept pointing out parts I hadn’t fitted, in case I missed them.
Came to just under £200 quid, took an hour to fit, luckily he paid after he saw me testing the appliance.
Is it working was his reply, nope was my reply. He looked confused for a second then began blaming me.
I then proceeded to show him the reason why the oven did not work properly, the terminal block bridges hadn’t been screwed in tight and started to melt the box, causing only half the appliances functions to operate.
He then had the check to ask for the parts to be removed and a refund.
The cone would have been handy, I could have shoved it up his back passage.
Re: dryer fire on bbc news this morning
Looks like an Electrolux group T/D to me from whats left.
Maybe time they let Martin loose with his loop and insulation tester, the new super hero, lets call him “Super Loopy Man”.
Re: Loop / Socket Testing.
Specialist01269 wrote: Turns out that all of the Downstairs sockets are the same, only thing wired properly & with a good Earth is the Cooker outlet.
Just goes to show as well what a waste of time it is.
Ducks down low for incoming. :boops:
Had you worked on the cooker you would have been none the wiser.
Regulation and enforcement is required, although nobody is going to ever police Mr Smith once he’s reached the age of 40 and becomes expert in all things from going some dodgy electrics.
Yearly mandatory safety checks/certification on every UK home for both Gas and Electrics should I feel be brought in.
I think its time, but also some perspective needs to be put in place, nothing is ever going to be 100{e5d1b7155a01ef1f3b9c9968eaba33524ee81600d00d4be2b4d93ac2e58cec2d} safe and compared to many countries our incident rates are excellent, even in homes with no earth, whilst the percentage of possibility dramatically increases nobody had yet been injured or killed in this example, and I’d bet there a many more homes just as bad or even worse.
Re: dryer fire on bbc news this morning
Beko got a hammering last night on ITV news (End of the world broadcasting channel), they quoted various appliances with issues currently around 125,000 still not modified.
I bet Beko customer care line is red hot today.
Re: The 0800 Thread
Sometimes I really wonder about the people on our industry, I really wish they would crawl back to the sh88 pit they crawled out of.
All you need is your tools, honest friendly face and the rest will find you.
Whats that saying “A pig in a Gucci dress is still a pig” or is it a “Tool on a van is still a Tool”.
Like I’ve said before, all that’s needed is a broken appliance and a engineer, the rest is b8888it dressing up designed to rip off the client with minimal effort.
Lets but the Beef back in, get back to basics, Viva La Revelocion.
Re: electrical safety testing ?
Martin wrote:Just the appliance we are working on eh? Not the leccy that it’s plugged into then? So we’re not qualified to report reversed polarity or missing earth connection at all?……..oh dear oh dear……..are we allowed to tell the customer that the machine is perfectly OK provided they don’t plug it in and use it, will our ‘qualifications’ at least stretch that far?
Your not responsible for the house beyond the plug, have you not been listening. :rotfl:
Which is why there is no regulation stating that you should by law carry out an Earth Loop, Continuity and Insulation test on a repair, its not required. :rolls:
Don’t take that as I believe you shouldn’t, I want it done, but lets put it into perspective and get some education, then change the rules. 😉
Do you present your driving license when you get your car serviced.
Not the garages responsibility what the user does to the product, hell nothing stopping you putting jet fuel in it, no more than Mrs Smith using nails into a socket instead of a plug.
You just need to make sure you didn’t put the jet fuel in or fit the nails.
Martin wrote:
On second thoughts lee8, don’t answer that, you’re not qualified.Too late. :rotfl:
Re: electrical safety testing ?
I was working for Brands present in both EU and UK, the only difference was EU reg’s where implemented in the UK, whilst the EU choose to ignore them.
Why a brand does this I have no idea as I’m not a legal expert but I guess its easier to sue in the UK.
People cut corners in the real world, not everybody is pedantic.
Now if the media was reporting on people being injured/killed etc etc.
Then start prosecuting people regularly, then that may just may improve the situation.
Safety testing is not compulsory for our industry and as far as I know, no appliance engineer has been prosecuted for not doing it. It may be good practice, but until a case happens as far as i’m aware if your not qualified and there is no requirement for the test you cannot be held responsible for anything beyond the appliance your working on.
Now instead of us all arguing, why don’t we start pushing for regulations to be brought in. :rotfl:
Re: sickness
Hmmm So employers can break the rules, place undue stress, threats and then complain that the employees either call sick with stress or take the piss.
I agree there are bad employees, i’ve worked with many, but in my yrs of experience bad employees are usually employed by bad employers.
The reason I left employment for self employment was due to a work ethic of “I work to live not live to work”.
I guess I may have an uneducated view, but I believe employees bring value and are paid that value, it does not suit me providing a company with far more value than I’m getting.
Which is why I currently work the hours that suit me for far more money than an employer pays.
Maybe that’s the big issue with the current world, too many people working to much for too little, only to provide riches for the owners/directors.
After all employees simply want a fair pay for a fair days works, or they’ll simply leave and go elsewhere. Due to current crisis employees are limited in this option, so many either crack or choose not to be walked on so take stupid measures.
I don’t believe I’m wrong, just honest. 😉
One guy I heard of worked for a large brand and the only reason he stayed and put up with the hours was because the brand was soo bad at stock control and there components fitted many other brands he was making far more from fiddles than he would if he left. Of course he got wind they knew and before they called him in he left.
Think about it. Maybe wrong, but if you keep poking the dog it will bite back one day :rolls:
Re: electrical safety testing ?
Gas safe has the power.
Yet last week I find an unqualified plumber fitting pipework and a gas appliance. The pipework was leaking, I call to find he returned couldn’t find the leak, disconnected, no warning label issued. I found the leak on the first joint I tested.
He did the work allowed the clients to use them and in 4 days time, the Safe registered plumber was calling to inspect the work and sign it off.
That’s illegal and so where several other AR issues, but they still left the appliance working.
So rules even when in place get broken but at least I can act under RIDDOR.
Re: electrical safety testing ?
spanner51 wrote:I have always beleived that unless you do something about the result of any test, then there is no point in doing it.
So if your test says a machine or installation is faulty, then doing nothing is worse than not doing the test.
Just my opinion.
I agree, especially when Mr Smith asks why its failed and what needs rectifying and your only reply is “I’m not qualified” as soon as the client gets a whiff of that, the whole point is wasted as most wont spent the call out charges/costs on the advice of an unqualified person. :rolls:
I only advocate its a waste for these reasons and I try to explain that further training (APPLIANCE QUALIFICATION) for our specific industry be implemented, as technically no engineer is qualified to work on appliance as there is no qualification. :rotfl:
The reason why we don’t have it, cost vs death/injury. Again the yrs i spent in EU no test every got done, no equipment was provided, and nobody ever got injured whilst I was there, even with Spain’s poor wiring methods and unskilled labour, nobody felt the need to implement H&S policys, no lifting training, high level limits etc etc etc, no injuries to anybody in the work place, no injury book, Nada. 😉
Re: Filippi Factory
PINKY wrote:There advertising for engineers. Are they any good to work for???
Depends if you like long hours, high mileage and poor management, stock etc etc.
They have a high turnover of peeps.
Re: £3000 Miele
eastlmark wrote:
Oddly IME, the reverse is true. Assuming its someone that can afford it, then the more they pay the more understanding they are regards service. They also believe they have an exlusive product and only a specialist can repair it so are content to wait it out.
If they cannot afford it and have credited themselves to the hilt to buy it then its a different matter. See my older “smeg in a council house” for thoughts on that one.I spent several yrs running around Marbella and Banus being abused by rich demanding clients and there cheap south american house keepers.
Dinner parties cooked by chefs in there homes where all the fashion, since the local restaurants where full of wannabes from London with no class or tourist outside photographing there cars. Try telling Mrs class act her 5 month old oven element is bo888ocked and the replacement will be in 2 months. :rolls:
Even worst the yachts with Gaggenau products.
